Choosing The Right Youth Hockey Coach

SPEAKER_00 1:23

How do you know who's the right coach for your kit? That's the topic today that Mike Benelli and I talk about in our kids play hockey. And we dive into it. We go on some little tangents like we always do, but we talk about uh what to look for uh in coaches moving forward, what not to look for, some red flags. We discuss that. And really the overall aura of really youth hockey and how to approach it from kind of a macro viewpoint each and every year. Uh, when you're looking at your team uh or other organizations, we know a lot of times this time of year, people are looking at other teams and other coaches. Uh, we just really want to equip you with maybe some of the questions you should be asking uh or they should be asking you uh as you take that journey. So that's happening right now on Our Kids Play Hockey. Uh, if you haven't already, make sure you join our Facebook group. It's Our Kids Play Hockey. It's a private group. You have to answer two yes or no, very easy to answer questions to get in that that grows by the day. Uh and also you have helped us uh eclipse uh every dream we had for this podcast. Uh so make sure you head over to ourkidsplayhockey.com. If you're looking for more episodes, or you're looking for gifts, or you're looking for some deals, we have them there. Um and again, your five-star reviews and your shares of this uh program is always appreciated. It helps us grow, it helps us build this community that we're trying to build, and that uh, you know, the belief that there are really some great hockey parents, players, coaches, and people out there. We know there are. We know you're out there as well you're listening. So without further ado, let's get into the episode with Mike and I of Our Kids Play Hockey. Hello, hockey friends and families around the world, and welcome to another edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. It's Leah Elias with Mike Benelli, Christy Cash Burns is on assignment today, but we got a great topic. One that I've been approached by a lot recently, Mike. A lot of parents, uh, a lot of listeners kind of emailing and asking questions about coaching staffs for next year. Everything from uh, do I look for quality or quantity? Do I look for this person? Do I look for that person? What should I look for? So today's topic is gonna be finding the right coach for your kid. And we're gonna go over lots of different ways to look at coaching. Uh, spoil alert, there is no one right answer. There's plenty of wrong answers, but there's no one right answer about what's perfect for your kid. But we are gonna try and dissect this topic uh as us the two coaches. Uh, just some tips and tricks of things you should be looking for, maybe have your heads up about uh before you, you know, sign a contract or make a decision or or uh you know sign your life away without knowing what you're really getting into. So, Mike, I'm excited to talk to you about this because I know this is one we talk about a lot off the air. Uh, we joked before the episode we'd need about four or five hours for this. We're gonna try and do it in about 45 minutes to the best of our ability. We'll get emails, right? We'll get emails, we'll have a follow-up episode.

SPEAKER_01 3:58

It's uh yeah, I mean, you could, you could, it it's a basically my every every uh weekend of my life discussion. So I think I could add a little bit to it today. And you know, it's just and it's one of those things where it is not one size fits all. It's um, you know, and it's and it's and honestly, a lot of it's out of your control as a parent. I mean, uh, you know, yes, you can look, you can research, you can get advice from other people. Um, but ultimately, you know, sometimes it's it's just you gotta say, well, the what's the what's the better, what's the better of the two evils or or what matters and what doesn't matter? And and I think a lot of the conversation today will revolve around, you know, how old is your kid and what level of hockey are they in, and then how much does that coach make in an impact of the development of your kid?

SPEAKER_00 4:42

Yeah, and it's funny because as I've had these conversations, it's had everything literally from the might level to people graduating high school and looking into the next level. So we are gonna kind of vul around all of that today. You know, the first one, we we got an email recently from a listener, uh, and just to submit it very quickly, the question was should I go to a paid certified level five USA hockey coach, or should I uh have my kid play for a volunteer parent coach? Uh uh again, the kid is younger, he's on the younger side. You know, I I'll I'll start the conversation with this, Mike is that um qualifications are nice, uh, formal training is nice, but at the end of the day, I think it really comes down to how dedicated is this person to both learning to be a coach and being a coach to your kid. Because one of the things that exists now that didn't exist when you and I were kind of growing up and getting coaches is that there's unlimited access to info. Anybody who wants to learn, like really wants to learn to be great right now, could do it. Uh, that's not negating uh USA hockey and the development model and the coaching certifications, they're all very important. I think that's part of the process if you're serious about being a coach. But I look for the person that is just enthralled with coaching and wants to make an impact. Um, and everyone's a little different. I have seen level five coaches that couldn't give a crap. I've also seen uh parent coaches that care an immense amount. You know what I mean? So I think if you got another person behind it.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

Yeah, it's almost offensive, actually, to me uh that sometimes I'll I'll be I'll be introduced as oh, this is Mike Benelli, he's a master level, level five coach and at USA hockey. And I'm like, yeah, but we do that all the time, Mike.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

We do that all the time.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

It is it is offensive when when I look at the other, when I look at the other coaches that are level five, master level coach. I mean, literally, this just happened this weekend. Mike, thanks so much for the advice. Thanks so much for helping me out. I've just completed my master level five coaching certification. I am now at the same level as you and I'm really proud of myself. And I'm like, you're you're not even close to the same level as me. And you're a horrendous coach. Like you're a great person, but you're but the so yes, are you with uh were you able to were you able to get through a weekend uh of USA hockey certification or hockey Canada or a European IIHF uh certification course? Sure. But when you look at those coaches that are doing it as a mandated kind of coaching certification, and then the level five is not mandated. I mean, that's just that's just something you do on your own. But it's the coaches that go through this the the the requirements that that are needed in your association and your governing body, but then the real the real key is those coaches that go out and use all the other things, you know, all the other sports, all their other experiences, all their other, you know, history and uh educate and re-educate and educate and re-educate themselves on the sport and and add to you know your child's development. So yeah, does be being a does being a level five coach, does getting your certification at level one really mean anything more than the certification piece? Uh in my opinion, no, it's needed. It at least checks a box. But the real coaches I want around my kids are are are coaches that are committed to learning, lifelong learners, lifelong teachers, and uh and and ultimately, you know, really good people.

SPEAKER_00 8:01

Right. Yeah, I totally agree with you. I kind of wrote on my notes here, you know, the qualifications versus quality. Uh, you can have both. You can have a very qualified coach with quality, but then again, you can have someone who's less experienced with a lot of quality. And I think that comes down to the focus and the goal of the coach, right? And there's a difference between coaches, and this is kind of where the age level comes in, that are really just focused on winning and getting their team or their organization to win so they can sell more spots for the next season, uh, and coaches who really are more focused on the people that they're developing. Uh, we've said it on the show a lot. My belief, this is my personal belief as a coach, is that if you create better people, you will create better players. That doesn't mean that you negate the hockey side of things and the skills side of things. That's not what I mean. I'm saying if you prioritize the person over the player, the player will naturally emerge. Um, not to mention, there is life after hockey. And I think any coach worth their salt has to know that at any level. When I was coaching college, I was very concerned about my students' grades and making sure they understood that, you know, we might not do this forever. Um, there's a lot of things. And then obviously, even at the might and the uh squirt level, right? Uh, it's a very impressionable age. And what you tell those kids and teach those kids at that age is incredibly important. Uh, you know, again, not to go into side tangent. I was just writing a post today about um competing versus competition, and that we don't do a great job as a society of teaching our kids how to compete. And thoughts like be thankful for having an opponent, be thankful for being tested, be thankful for having opportunities to be you versus you and you versus somebody else. We don't teach these things. And what do we teach, Mike? We teach it's us versus them, and the scoreboard matters. And if we're not winning at the end of the game, you suck, I suck, we suck. So rounding this back out, it's all about the questions you ask prior to a season. So when people come to me and say, What do you think of this coach? What do you think of that coach? I say, Well, ask great questions and you'll get great answers. Questions like, How were the practices last year? I don't know. Go ask someone. How did the coach uh handle the kids on and off the ice? I don't know. Go ask. Those are the types of questions I think, Mike, and I'd love to get yours too, that you need to be asking. If your question's just how did the team do last year, wins and losses, man, you're setting yourself up. You're setting yourself up for disappointment in my mind.

SPEAKER_01 10:23

Yeah, I used to use the example a lot, uh, you know, in in my director role with with parents is that like when I was an admissions director at a at a at a prep high school for a number of years, I never got asked like where the English teacher went to school and when where the chemistry teacher graduated from and what dissertations they have done, or you know, what their level of uh science was, or you know, I never got asked. I always got asked, you know, where did the hockey coach, where did he play? And how long did he play? And what level did he play? I'm like, well, he played at all these levels, but you know, he's uh he's just not a nice person, he's a bad person. So so what it is, what level you played, and you know, all those questions are you know definitely valid for parents, right? You go in and you say, listen, I'm looking for it like I said earlier, too. It's it's hard. Sometimes you don't have the choice of looking and and you know, but but what but if you can, right? If you could, you'd say, Well, what what do I want at the 8U and 10U level? I want a coach that gets on the ice that's smiling, I want somebody that's enjoying themselves, I want somebody that's organized and understands child development and teaches and teaches my kids that winning is so important, right, but not the only thing that's important, that competing and learning how to compete, like like the coaches that say, oh great, those the top, their top two kids aren't here. They they they're in COVID protocol. We could win this game. Like, well, that's not really I I said I don't understand what that even means. Like, what do you mean their top two kids aren't here, so now you can win the game? Don't you want their top two kids there so you can win the game? Like, that's the way I've always looked at it. I'm like, if we're gonna compete, let's compete against their let's let let me see their team as their team is. So yeah, if you're an eight you, well, let's well, this this audience, right? It's like six you, four you, if you're for you, six you, ten you, find somebody that's smiling, that's happy, that loves coming on the ice, that knows your kid's name immediately, like that is engaged in learning and and doesn't like doesn't start a parents meeting with okay, we have our 18 tournaments planned for the next 25 weeks, and you're not allowed to play soccer anymore, and you have to commit to us. And again, there's time and a place for coaches to demand all these other things out of our athletes at 10 and 8 and 6 is not the time.

SPEAKER_00 12:45

I agree.

SPEAKER_01 12:46

Um, and it's uh and I think most of us agree. And that's you know, that that's where I fall into this, you know, horrible category of of being jaded and and uh and upset sometimes with the youth hockey world. And the fact is, 96% of it is so great. There's so many good coaches. I run into coaches that are so energized, and because they didn't win, like they're on the inner, they're not in the top league that they don't get recognized as top coaches. And it's so funny that if you looked at where their kids are going, how fast kids develop in their program and then go to the elite team, that's the coach I want.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

Right.

SPEAKER_01 13:21

And I don't want to leave that coach. If I could do anything I can, if I could, if I could stay with that type of person as long as I can for my kid, that's what you want. Because often, I mean, listen, the the the the phrase the grass isn't always greener isn't a phrase that just came up because it doesn't happen all the time.

SPEAKER_02 13:41

Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 13:42

It's it's it's in our it's in our vernacular, but because it happens all the time. It happens daily. So you know, the grass isn't always greener. And oftentimes if you fertilize your own grass, it's gonna get to be where you want it to be anyway. So get in there, help that coach, help develop your kids, keep your kid within with good, good people, and ultimately, if they're able to do it by by their God-given talent of their body, they're going to go where they got it, where they're gonna go.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

Yeah, there's that great saying you remind me of of like when when something's wrong with a flower, you don't work on the flower, you you you work on the environment surrounding the flower, right? To to improve it. But a lot of people think that means just grabbing the flower and moving it to another another patch, right? When the the ground you're on is perfectly good, you just need to spend a little time on it. Um, you know, that's a good one. Mike, you also brought up a great point that I think gets overlooked sometimes uh with our discussions, which is that winning is very important to to coaches like you and me, and and every coach. Uh, I think it just comes down to the different definitions of winning. Um, I'm a very competitive person. I want the kids I coach or the adults I coach to win every game we play. I want that. All right, but it is not the ultimate win. Uh, one of my one of my favorite things that happens, um, and I and I take note of this, uh, and this is really my one of my gauges of success, aside from from records or or trophies, which is it's there, but it's not, it's not in the top. Uh, is when a when a young man or woman, or, or older man or woman, now at this point, I've been doing this 20 years, comes up to me and says, You really made an impact on my life. Uh, or that they're just really happy to see me and that they know that you know they appreciated the time with me and the team. When that happens, it's amazing, right? Um, and again, most of these teams succeed uh in terms of wins and losses. I don't want to, you know, sugarcoat it. I'm just saying that that to me is when a kid says, a kid comes up to me and says, Wow, I really loved playing for you. That's how I know personally that I'm doing a good job. All right. And and, you know, coaches love kids like that because they they were listening too. You know, and I think this comes back to this, is what we're saying here is that there's kind of a difference between a growth mindset and a what have you done for me lately mindset. Now, just to be clear, when you get to the higher levels, uh, you know, midget, junior, college, and definitely pro or paid hockey, coach has every right to have the what have you done for me lately mindset because it's a job at that point, uh, or there's a million people trying to get those spots. Now, with that said, to coach at that level, you still have to have some bravado of understanding how to develop a player. It's just a little bit uh different in how that shifts. Mike, did you want to say something on that?

SPEAKER_01 16:26

Well, I'm just but so, but it's ironic though, that the coaches that are great at managing the top players in the world understand that the human emotion and the and and the allowing the flower to grow and not completely always change in the environment is the recipe for success. So, what pro coaches try to do with their, you know, the what pro GMs try to create in their locker rooms, what head college scouts and recruiters try to create in their locker rooms is what we should be creating in our locker rooms at eight, nine, and 10-year-olds. We're just at a different scale. Fun is fun. You know, finding good people is finding good people. Finding competition within your team is is the same at eight as it is at 18. It is. It just you treat it a different way. Competition for eight-year-olds might be who won, you know, how fast you could clean the locker room or something, or or you know, who could run around the rink in warm-ups the fastest, or who could do the most jumping jacks, or you know, real developmental pieces. Where, you know, at the pro level and the college level, it could be like, wow, you're you're the best penalty killer in in the world right now. Like you're doing something that nobody else is doing. And and we're I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna make sure that I'm I'm I'm I'm giving you the freedom to become this great person. Although I know you want to be this other person, right now your role is this person. And you know, I don't I don't know if I don't know if parents at the youth level uh not only don't understand, but they won't accept roles anymore. They don't accept that players develop at at different times anymore. They don't they don't accept that my kid doesn't always have to be on the top team to be the top player. Like there's gonna be ebbs and flows. And I think as a parent, when you look for a coach, that's when I'm when I'm researching coaches and working with coaches, you know, I want to find people and that that understand that the highs and lows, like they don't react to the highs and lows. Like they're not the ones crazy, like I was always crazy, but I think I was crazy at the that wins and losses. Like I I'm I was always high energy, you know. That I mean, I'm just always like it passionate about right.

SPEAKER_00 18:40

I don't I don't think you're crazy. I think passion is the word driven.

SPEAKER_01 18:43

Well, and you know, when I look at other people, I'm like, wow, that guy looks crazy. I'm like, that looks like you. So I and I get and I think but I think it's just I think it's just the emotional piece. Now, is it and I don't and I think at but at eight and nine, I think we as long as you are a parent that says, wow, that person just really loves being out here with my kids. Oh, and and maybe the bonus is, and we'll get to this, right? But the bonus is he's he's my kid's friend's dad or mom or like like you know, how do you find really good young or any coaches that coach young kids? It's so so hard. And and really there's a reason why, you know, it's really reasonable I think why a lot of coaches get like this kind of ego that they can move places and people will all follow them because there's very few people like them, and sometimes that's that's at the detriment of the organization and and frankly the the players, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:38

You know, you're bringing up a good point too. Uh I'm equating this to the younger kids. Kids love to compete, right? It's um I'm starting to realize it's actually we sometimes as parents and coaches jade them from what competition really is. And a great example, right? When we do off ice or on ice, the ADM does a lot with this. Like you said, hey, who can be who can be the quickest at picking up all the pucks? What team can be quicker at uh winning this tic-tac-toe running a contest that I'm running today? There's gonna be a winner, there's gonna be a loser, but let's compete. Uh now, again, when the game ends, some kids are usually upset, but that's part of learning how to compete, right? I think where we get in trouble as coaches and parents, um, and and this should ring a bell for a lot of people, is saying things like, you have to be great today, you have to win this game. That's not teaching competition, that's setting ultimatums that honestly, eight and nine-year-olds, they just convert it to fear of losing, which is honestly one of the worst things you can do. All right. And here's what I mean old school people will say, no, a fear of losing is a good thing. You should fear losing. That's how I was great. Um, I I don't agree. I think hating to lose is a good thing. I see kids all the time that hate to lose, they get mad, they throw things, they they scream because they hate to lose. I want to cultivate that. I want to help them get control of their emotions. And I tell them, I like that you don't like losing. I like that you hate to lose, but we got to control how you are when you lose. I'm not creating fear, I'm creating control. All right. And again, look, there's there we continue to have the old school, new school coaching debate of uh just gotta be hard on them, you gotta be hard on them, you gotta teach them, you gotta let them know. Um, there's so much literature and research that that style is not as effective of what as what we're talking about.

unknown 21:31

Right.

SPEAKER_00 21:31

Go ahead, Mike.

SPEAKER_01 21:32

Yeah, but it it is for some kids. There's no doubt about it. Like, I've seen kids very get listen, I I've had I've had conversations with kids that I look at, I'm like, do you really like this is fun for you? Like I love, like, I love that coach so-and-so is calling me out. You know, I love that competition. But the problem is they don't even know the other side. Like, there are there are you know a hundred different ways to skin a cat. And I think it's like I don't even know what I so so you're so so you're in this role, right? Where I think there's a better way we could do it. But and and again, at in my own at fault, I always look at this through the lens of growth. I always look at it through the lens of what is the end game? Like, where where are we gonna be? If I'm in a if I'm in a facility with a youth hockey organization and I look at 50 kids, 58 youth, I just know, I know, not just statistically, but factually, that out of those 50 kids, only probably 20 to 25 of them are gonna be left when they're 16 and 17. So I fall to what can we do from eight to 16 that allows us to have as many of those kids, 80% of those kids, 90% of the co kids, still in the mix. So then we can really determine whether or not we were successful and whether or not the the the our program's gotten better. And that's what I want to look like. That's kind of like you know, I I go back and forth a lot. That's why I like I love coaches that work with their kids, like we saw in the like in uh like the hockey factories uh program, right? That that worked with their kids for four years. I would love that four years, or yeah, like like you have you find a great person, and that person And cultivates this environment throughout a player's um you know life so that then they're still around, whether or not they were the best player or the worst player, they're developing all different levels and times, but that they're still around. Right. And they didn't have you know 15 different hockey bags in their garage over the 15 years of going from program to program to program. It's it's the it's and I always I look at it from the lens of I do I just know when your kid is 14 years old, they're gonna make a choice whether they were the best player on your ice or the worst, they're gonna either continue to play or quit. And we want the kids that aren't gonna, we want the kid, if we're a parent, and and it's not ROI, it's not like it's not like, oh, I've invested this time. It's I love this time, I love this time with you, I love this time in the rink, I love our our life being in this kind of world. If we're gonna choose a world to be in, this is a cool world to be in. I like it. So why don't we try to develop, excuse me, try to develop uh and cultivate a culture that allows us to do it for as long as possible. And when you find coaches that are mercenaries that are trying to, they're already looking to replace eight kids before before January 1st, that's just not cultivating any kind of culture, and certainly not cultivating your kid, even if your kid is one of those better kids.

SPEAKER_00 24:40

Right. Well, and look, expanding on that, uh, key words here you're saying culture, right? You you know when an association or organization is has or is developing culture. I think that is a very important prerequisite for you and your child when you're looking for a team, much less a coach, right? Kids will love to play for a coach that creates a great culture. Um, second point you made about um identifying those kids that maybe are motivated in a harsher way. Uh, this is my response then, Mike. A great coach will find out how every player on his or her team is motivated and know it. All right. A amateur coach will just assume that everybody's motivated the same way, typically the way that coach was motivated as a child. All right, and that's why you get kind of old school coaching sometimes of coaches yelling and screaming. I see it less and less, which I think is a good thing. Yeah, a great coach will say, okay, kid A needs to be talked to directly, kid B needs it a little softer. We're talking about youth hockey right now. All right. A great coach will figure that out. And we, and by the way, we do this in the pro level. We got to know how our athletes are motivated. Now, there is a point if the kid is a victim or the player is a victim and they're not working, that you got to make decisions. All right. But even then, I want to help that player work through that. But if it gets to a point where they're self-deprecating the point they can't perform, all right, we got to make some decisions. But I actually find that to be more rare than anything. So again, when you're looking for a coach, a coach that knows how every kid is motivated and can talk to a player and a B player differently on the same team, knowing that he's going or she's going to get the best out of them. That's something I look for. Um a lot, right? And and again, I get this. This one is one that boggles my mind. Coaches, well, how do I figure that out? How do I figure out how they're motivated? You ask them just point blank, how are you motivated? All right. Uh, well, my kid won't know that answer. That's probably an answer your kid should know. And as the parent, guess what? You probably do know.

SPEAKER_01 26:36

Well, and I that's so there's a great, so let's stop it for there for one second when you're looking for a coach. Find the coach that's willing to sit down with you as a parent and determine how are we going to motivate your child? Because what I'm gonna do is this. This is how I, this is how just I how I am. And and again, I'm not even blaming the coaches so much when you're having these conversations because we're not preparing them. Like we're just throwing them in. Hey, you played college hockey? Oh, that's sweet. You know, you and then you've been playing men's league for a couple of years, and now you you kind of get the bug to want to come back and help out. Great. Hey, you got the score an A team. Go get them, boy. Go get them. And I'm like, I'm like, are you kidding me? We've we've we've we've literally just unleashed you on a bunch of children that at every other point in their life are being directed and instructed and taught by people that have eight-year degrees in teaching. And then we're asking somebody who who had a good slap shot to psychologically dissect a kid and understand how to coach them. Like to me, that's the that's the fault of the organization. Now, so you know, maybe you go backwards and say, well, how do I find an organization that knows how to cultivate coaches, right? That knows how to teach and develop my kid, right? And so if I, you know, and again, you know, I used to laugh at so I'll give you the story about the parent paid coach, right? So my first job out of college is was as a hockey director, and all the parents and we had a couple of pros that had kids in the program. And the the the the the standing rule in the organization was there was no parent coaching, right? You couldn't have parent coaching. So my job was to tell the parents they weren't allowed to coach. So I go off to the one gentleman, and I'm like, listen.

SPEAKER_00 28:17

You were probably a fan favorite after that.

SPEAKER_01 28:19

I'm like, I'm like, listen, um, I know I'm gonna get in trouble for this, but you can come on the ice anytime you want to come on, and I'll deal with the repercussions, but there's really no parent coaching. But I just, if you can just help me and by having these ground rules, so I know I can fight for you to be on the ice. And so, you know, Mr. Dion said, it's no problem. I'll come out and teach and I'll work, and I'm not gonna yell at kids because that's not who I am. Like, I'm gonna teach. So if you're I'm gonna tell Marcel Dion he can't come on the ice with his kids. Same thing happened just recently. We just talked about um uh you know, Marty St. Louis' son.

SPEAKER_00 28:54

Just real quick, for those of you who may not know Marcel Dion is an NHL Hall of Famer. Oh, sorry, sorry.

SPEAKER_01 28:58

If you're listening to this podcast and you don't know who Marcel Dion is, then you're you're a new hockey parent. Yeah, pause, pause the podcast and look at it.

SPEAKER_00 29:06

M-A-R-C-E-L-D-I-O-NE.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

You'll know who's Martin, you'll know who Marty St. Louis is. So Marty St. Louis is the same situation. Like, well, oh, you're his kid's just you know gonna be out there with his dad? Like, yeah, I want that dad on the ice. Yeah, yeah. So yes, he may know what he's talking about.

SPEAKER_00 29:23

He he also may be the head coach of the Montreal Canadians right now.

SPEAKER_01 29:27

So technically he's a paid coach, right? So I think it's like he's not just a parent coach, but I just want to find like when I you know when we talk about finding good people, find the best developers, but again, I think it goes back to, you know, and maybe that's a whole nother conversation, is what can we do as organizations to make sure that we're not throwing our good hockey people, our players, into situations where they're not even able to comprehend what we're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

I'll tell you one right now, Mike, that that I think organizations need to do more is let's just say you have a college graduate played NCAA or high level of college hockey. Um, when possible, this is not always possible, that coach should be an assistant to another coach. And I don't care if that coach is a dad that has been coaching might for four years. That dad or that mom knows more than that college kid does about coaching that age group. Um, I used to say this story all the time last year. Um, my son's first year of Might, I went to that coach and said, I am your student because I've never coached at this level. And I'm so thankful that I did that because I really didn't know what I was doing, right? And again, my coaching knowledge expands. And it's funny because, and Mike, you'll laugh at this, having coached uh at the Adam and youth level voluntarily for the last few years, it's affected how I'm coaching the adults now, right? It's it's it's evolved me as a coach. Now, I'm not saying we do goo goo gaga stuff with the the adults, but it's totally given me different perspectives. And that's the point I want to make too, right now. Look, we all have to start coaching somewhere if we want to be a coach, right? Some people do it earlier than others. And uh look, young coaches are gonna make mistakes. That's natural. Older coaches make mistakes. What I look for is what do they do to learn? All right. I don't want my kid playing for a coach that thinks he or she just knows it all and doesn't care about expanding their coaching repertoire. Also, with that said, this is a funny one. How you coach, and I can attest to this, how you coach prior to having kids and after having kids is is typically very different. All right. I I made all the classic mistakes, young, oh it's not just young coaches. Somebody, I think Mike, you said that we shouldn't limit it to young coaches, but I made all the classic mistakes I think that that newer coaches make in micromanaging everything, trying to have my hands on everything, over-demanding, pushing, pushing, pushing, because that's how I was motivated. Um, and you know, I evolved from that. But when I had children, it totally changed my perspective. Because now suddenly you're raising someone, you see it, you know, everybody's kid becomes your kid at times when you're on the ice, uh, at least from the youth level, and you you understand things, but that's the evolution. So where I'm going with this is this, because I'm on a little bit of a tangent. Knowing kind of where a coach is on their journey is important, but don't discount anybody. If they're trying to learn and they really care about your kids, and I've said this before on shows, for the most part, Mike, parents don't understand how much we care about their kids. I really believe that it's not a shot at parents, but like I really care about the kids on my my son's team. I really care about, you know what I mean? Um, just short of being my own kit. Like, I I treat them that way. Um, you want to look for um it sounds weird I just said that, but you you look for people that care because they're gonna get good coaching one way or another. And like you said, smiling, right? It doesn't matter if they know what a one-three-one with a left-wing lock neutral zone trap is when they're eight. It's a relevant experience.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

No, matter of fact, it's probably better they don't know. I agree. Just the like like the the like the I listen, I just think that finding, but but listen, I I I I work with so many of these teams that that when they're hearing this, right? They're gonna be, oh Mike, you're such a BS artist. Like, I cannot believe you're saying this and then saying this. Because I do so somebody's gonna do it. So maybe the organizations that do it have to do it. Like when you have to create plans and and schemes and teach the kids systems at an early age to win, it's because of the pressure of winning helps you in your mind, thinks you're growing the organization. So people are attracted to that. But it's a it's a vicious, like by doing that, you're actually diminishing the hockey IQ of the players that now when they get older need to be worked on. And and I guess if you're if you're somebody like me who says, I love working with 14 to 18-year-old kids that need hockey IQ work because that's how I make my living, great. Teach all the kids in the world, you know, what systems are so I can, but to to unteach things and to reteach things in a different way at the at a brain that's basically much more developed than a six and seven and eight-year-old brain is so difficult to do that when I look for a coach and I'm looking at an organization and I well after the background check, I look and say, okay, so so this person, how many, how many players, this person coached last year? How many players from their team are coming back? None? Oh, that's why I made the team? Cool. Or uh or I find out that I'm being here's a red flag for any parent of an eight-year-old, nine-year-old, ten-year-old. If the coach is recruiting you aggressively to have you come to their team to get because they said they got to get rid of six kids that they have in their team, you're next year's six kids.

SPEAKER_02 34:39

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 34:40

So don't think that you're getting recruited to a team that a coach was unable to develop the kids. If you're a good coach and you pick a team in now in this world, right, April, which is which is it's a whole nother conversation. So now we we pick a kid in April, and then next April I'm cutting that same kid. That's on the coach. If you're a developer, you're a coach, you're a good person, you find the kid and keep the kid and develop the kid. If the first now again, the kid never came to practice. They only chose they played for three different teams, they didn't give my team a priority. Uh the bantam took uh seven majors last year. We can't have that. Yes, get rid of the kid. I get it. You you gotta move on sometimes. Yeah, that's so much you can do. But if you're if you're if you're going and trying out for a team at the eight-year-old level, and kids not willingly left, and I don't know that I don't know if that's a good measure. They were cut for a new eight group of kids, don't go to the program.

SPEAKER_00 35:41

Right.

SPEAKER_01 35:42

You're the other group, you're the next group.

SPEAKER_00 35:44

This goes back, and I'm I hate to use this metaphor, but this is like when you have a partner and that partner cheated on their last three partners, and you go, No, they wouldn't do that to me. That's gonna happen. There's no trust there. Um, another thing, too, Mike, you brought this up too, just about kind of the tactics. Uh no, don't get me wrong. There are there are hockey skill sets and knowledge of the game that are important to teach as you develop. But the game is always evolving. I'll give you a great example. When I was a kid, we were taught yes, D to the winger, winger to the center, center out to the neutral zone, you go in, and then this position goes to get the puck. The game isn't played that way anymore. It isn't? No, no, we I have this discussion all the time: F1, F2, F3, um, or even D in the zone. Like we coach the game totally different now at the higher levels. There's no D to the wing anymore.

SPEAKER_01 36:34

I gotta rethink every regroup drill I've seen over the last four weeks in practice.

SPEAKER_00 36:39

But I that that's my point is that that the game is gonna evolve. And like I said, the way we coach it today in 15 years will be different again.

SPEAKER_01 36:47

Right, but but but can a player pivot? Can a player turn with the puck? Can a player turn on a dime? Can a player make a decision and make a head fake and switch?

SPEAKER_00 36:59

Well, I look, I'll give you good examples here, okay? Again, Mike is making the great point here of age-specific development, right? Uh, if your kid can pick the puck up off the ice in a Michigan style at eight years old, but cannot stop on both feet. I what are we doing? Right, and it's great, by the way. If you could do the Michigan, I'm not negating the creativity.

SPEAKER_01 37:20

If you're able to be, if you're able to get into the zone and do the Michigan every shift and score, I'm like, be the Michigan guy. Yeah, oh nuts. Don't ever learn how to skate. You don't need to.

unknown 37:29

Right.

SPEAKER_01 37:30

You can't. Like I always say, like the kids would always say, Well, cooch, I'm I'm I'm just scoring at will. Like I could just score. Why would I want to make that play? Why would I want to do the two pass rule? All right, well, yeah, you know, basically, if you could score every single shift for the rest of your life, right? Don't ever pass.

SPEAKER_00 37:45

Mike, look, I'll give a really great example here. All right. I I can tell you, I remember, you're not saying you need about 10,000 hours of anything to really perfect it. Right. And I'm I'm not saying I'm going to get scared any NHL level here, but I remember the time period where I was hitting that 10,000 hours. And I'll tell you why. Um, and and there was kind of a clicking moment, which was oh wow, I have enough muscle memory built up now from my body that when someone shows me something, I can learn it in one and two tries on there because the combination of all those muscle memories and all those drills now creates this situation, right? Or as tactics change, I need to be able to shift my body. All right, again, we're we're we're still talking about coaching here, but we are yeah, we are. My point is that the the culmination of all those teachings allowed me to play a certain way. So if a coach comes in and says, Look, I'm a tactical genius and our squirt team is gonna win because of this, if those kids cannot operate their bodies to to do those tactics, which they won't be able to most of the time, you're gonna have a problem. So you want to look for a coach that says, Look, I'd love to play this system in squirt, but before we get there, we need to do this, this, or this. Or we always talk about special teams. That's one that gets to we need to have a great power play in squirt. Well, look, there's a lot of skill sets you need to have to know how to do a power play correctly. All right. And if you don't start from the baseline and teach those kids those skills, your power play is gonna suck.

SPEAKER_01 39:16

Right. So I want to preface, I want to preface something here because I'm getting again, this is where I get myself in trouble. There are there are 10-year-olds and nine-year-olds and eight-year-olds that do look like professional hockey players when they play. There's there's no doubt about there are teams that can do all of the things you're saying. They can set up a power play, they can do a left-wing lock, they can, they can scissor down the boards, they can create space, they can there, there's there's no doubt about it. They are, they're there. Now, whether or not what we're doing with them is good or bad, it's not my it's not my place. It's that's the team they're on. But after that 5% of kid, the rest of us, the rest of the kids are not that kid. And if you think you're gonna catch up, you're not because you're doing the same thing that they're doing that you can't do yet. Like you're trying to, you're you're dumbing the game down for the kids that don't have the skill because you want to win. And when you have a coach that says, Well, we're gonna play the system to win, but I'm gonna negate the fact that you have to have any skill involved, right, right, then those kids will never catch up. So if your goal is to have your kids surpass the kids that are already doing these things, then you need to be in a different developmental setting. And I like my fear and from my anecdotal evidence of watching what's happening, we're all trying to be those top 10 percenters. Like we're all trying to have the kids that are the top 12 kids in a region playing on a team. We think that's all of our kids, and it's just not. And but who am I to say? I mean, I listen, I get you know, I I get looked at like uh, you know, you know, people thumbing their nose at me all the time because they're like, we don't know what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 41:05

I'll support you here. I'll support you with this. Thank you. Thank you. Bill, Bill, Bill Belichick is a great example of what you're talking about. All right, arguably the greatest coach of all time, one of definitely in the NFL. His players say constantly, that man knows more about my position than I do. And it's every position on the field. And he takes the time to teach his players how they should play that position. And this goes into what we're talking about. Even at the most elite level, Mike, a coach knows that if you want to succeed, he's gonna have to teach, or she's gonna have to teach those players to understand that position. To just assume that they're gonna know the position as a coach, I think is a mistake. All right. Now, there is some expectation, and expectations rise, but there's gonna be a certain amount of skill level associated with that position, or you wouldn't have made the team. Yeah, but coaches teach. All right. I've said this before. When your ego trumps your ability to teach, you're not a coach anymore. All right. When you I can do this, well, then go back and play. All right. Um, I want to keep going here because we're talking about some red flags here. All right. So I have three red flags written down. Uh, first one is is one I have a quick story about is yes, men and women. People say yes all the time. I I fell into this trap one time when I was younger. Uh, and I'll tell you how it played out. We had a coach that said yes to everything, all of my all of my wants and dreams and needs. This coach said yes to and and promised me the world. And to be fair, at that time I'd never heard that before. Um, you know, it was up and coming. I was excited about it. First year we played together, Mike, won a championship. It was fantastic. I I it was one of my favorite seasons. That coach continued to yes, everybody, new players, new people. Second year, uh, didn't work out that way. In fact, the team collapsed. All right. Um, I'm not saying it was all on the coach, right? I mean, there's things I could have done differently too. And the team deteriorated slowly over the few years because it was yes, yes, yes, yes, yes to everything. That's a red flag. All right, if if a coach has met all of your quote unquote demands, first off, that's great, but think about it. All right, if they're saying yes to you, they're probably saying yes to everybody, even if your kid is the best player on the team. So that's one, and that goes hand in hand with what you said, uh, Mike, is hatchet men and women, right? That there's a lot of players leaving the team every year. Like he cuts players because he or she wants to win. Well, be careful with that. Um, and then the last one I have here is coaches that move around a lot. They jump from organization to organization to organization. And then look, if you're trying to become a professional coach, we see this a lot. You know, you stay a few years with the team and you move on because you're trying to move up. Um, those coaches still, though, what what way are they moving? Are they moving laterally or are they moving up? All right. Head coach of the the Tampa Bay Lightning is a great example. Coached at every level up. They kept moving up, moving up, moving up. You gotta look for that. That that's a good sign. Go ahead, Mike.

SPEAKER_01 43:55

Yeah, no, and if you're an assistant coach at the college level, the junior level, the major junior level, the pro level, and you're an assistant, you're a video coordinator, you're in the staff, you're gonna move. You're gonna find you know what fits, what gives you the most money. You gotta make a living.

SPEAKER_00 44:08

I mean, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:09

It's our job. But if you're a if you're a pee-wee coach or a 10 U coach or an 8U Mike development coach, and you go from pro and you have a program. I mean, I've seen it every day here. I mean, every day I see program people that run pro r run a team and they're and they're not happy with the team, like you're running the team. It's your team.

SPEAKER_00 44:28

It's your team.

SPEAKER_01 44:29

Well, the team sucks.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

Well, it's your team. It's your team, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:32

Maybe instead of running, like, well, I'm just gonna run and do a team somewhere else and try to cover.

SPEAKER_00 44:37

Or Mike, Mike, they're not giving me the best players. That's what I've heard before.

SPEAKER_01 44:41

They're not allowing me to get the best players. I'm like, yeah, but you're but uh what so what are you so and again? If you're a great uh if you're a great recruiter and you can get an organization to pay you to recruit kids to your organization, you know, hey, go nuts. I mean, but if you're a parent that goes and follows that great recruiter, just know that they're out, they're good, their job is to out recruit your kid. Like, so so if you're yes, if you want to go from program to program, wear different jerseys every year. And and if you're a coach who doesn't care about, you know, you want to wear a different sweatsuit every year and jump on the ice and jump on any program you can, that's Fine, honestly, if you're making a living and you're a paid, you know, if you're loose, what I'd loosely term a pro coach at the youth level, that's how you make your living, coaching, and you're a mercenary, then then then that's I don't know. I don't find I don't see anything wrong with it. I find what's what I find wrong with it is the parents that follow it. These are high functioning, very smart individuals, people that own businesses, people that are you know, high functioning people in their society, and they fall for this trap that this coach is gonna be the panacea of my child's development, because I'm gonna he's gonna put the best 15 kids on a roster together and be uh what's what's my favorite term right now, like a like a bomb squad, right? That they're gonna be a bomb squad. Oh, we got a bomb squad. Oh, yeah, that's great. But where where are you? You have if so if you're that paid coach and every year you have a bomb squad, I have no problem with you. I think I actually think it's great if you can make a great living and have a bomb squad every year. What I do, what I do, what I do have a problem with is the who we're speaking to right now. It's the parents that if you think that your kid is not on the on uh getting cut from the bomb squad next year, you're mistaken, you're wrong, and and it will happen, and then you'll and then you'll be like, I can't believe that. Just to your point earlier, I can't believe that coach did that. Oh, you mean the set the coach that did that for the last eight years? You can't believe that that's who you got. Well, you get what you get, and you don't get upset.

SPEAKER_00 46:46

And you don't get upset. That's what we say. All the kids look, look, I because we're again this is one of those episodes we can go for four hours. I I I want to say this that there is a lot of gray area in everything we're talking about. Those bomb squads you're talking about, Mike. Sometimes there's great coaches on those teams, and there's a lot of people vying to be on, but you know those coaches are great because they find consistent success with their teams, with their players. The players love them. It's rare, but it happens. But I I think what we're talking about is you know, the bomb squad that wins the first year, and then the next year they don't because there's no team chemistry, and you know, there's no way of moving forward. I think also, too, I want to I want to say this, I think it's important to say this. There are absolutely situations, parents, where your kids should shift organizations that you might need to go find a new team. Like these these things do happen. All right. I'd be a hypocrite if I didn't say that. All right, I did that when I was a kid. Um, I think it's important that you do a self-evaluation before you jump ship, though, and really be honest with yourself of is it me? Is it the coach? Is it the environment? Um, and sometimes those things don't line up, and that's okay, right? If you find a better uh organization position for your kid where they're gonna grow, uh yeah, you you have to do it, right? You have to look at it, you have to consider it, I should say. Um, but at the same time, if your kid had a tough year, analyze why the year was tough, right? And analyze if is this was this more accountability on us? Is it on the organization? Is the grass greener on the other side? I I always say if you're making a lateral move, really think about it. All right, really, if if you're going from tier two to tier one and your kid's ready, that's that's a different conversation, right? Uh, but just make sure your kid's ready because if they're not, that's gonna be fun too. I just wanted to uh at least finalize this, Mike, and we can keep going for a minute, but uh, some things I wanted to say um from my own experience about the best coaches I've ever had. All right. And and I always kind of bring these up when I'm helping people make their decisions. Um, and some of these coaches I had for so first off, I had I had way less great coaches than bad coaches, in my opinion. All right, they were rare, and sometimes they were unexpected. Uh a few of the people I'm thinking of, I didn't want to play for their team. I was I was just on their team. They ended up becoming the best coach, which shows you that there's a lot, a lot of roll of the dice in this, no matter what. But the best coaches, and this is what I look for, challenged me. They challenged me to be better and they were honest with me. Even at my younger ages, when I maybe didn't like that so much, they did it in a way that I could understand. I want you to be better, and I'm challenging you. Sometimes it came through missing shifts, sometimes it came through talking. That was one. Number two, and I think maybe this is the most important one, they taught me. They spent the time to sit down with me and teach me the game or what I can do better. There's some accountability on me to learn it, but they took the time, knowing I wanted to learn and taught me. And then the third thing, and this is one that that I think goes under the radar. They stood up for me, right? If I was working my butt off and things weren't going well, they stood up for me. They wouldn't let the team bury me. You know, Lee's working his butt off. He's trying, he's not where he needs to be, but he's working. They built me up in front of my teammates when it was deserved. I gotta stress that. You can't do this if kids not working hard. But those are the three things. They challenged me, they were honest with me, they taught me, they stood up for me, they built me up. Uh, that, especially at the younger youth levels. If you're not getting those things, I think that's a red flag to me. All right. As you get older, they still exist, they just morph a little bit. All right. A certain level of professionalism, a certain level of effort is expected when you're 18 or 25 or 35. All right. But the things I'm still gonna challenge my players, I'm still gonna teach my players, and I'm still gonna stand up for my players at any age group. That to me, that's the sign of a great coach. All right. And the great coach has taught me that that you know, through time. So I think if I'm trying to leave anybody with anything, that's what I tell people when you're making decisions. And and I'm telling you again, Mike, tell people listening, it's still a roll of the dice. All right. You never know, you just never really know what you're getting until you're there. All right. I I wish I could say, yeah, play for that coach. That's the guy or that's the girl. You're gonna have a great season. I I I never do that. You just never know. You might not get along with that person. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 51:06

All right. Well, and and and the coach is only the product of his players. So, you know, if you bring in a but, you know, if you if you if you're a listen, if you're a great coach and and you I'm always that coach, I'm always that person who probably ends up coaching. Like I I've never I've never liked taking great teams and playing with them and just kind of being on the bench and watching them play. I don't know. I've always loved taking like the the team that I felt I could, you know, I could fix. Like the player, like the players, I'm like, oh no, that player, I could fix them. I could do something with that player. I love that too. I could do that. Like that's fun, that's fun for me. Like to me, I'm like, I you know what, he got cut from all those other teams, but I see something, there's something there. And sometimes it's like, damn it, they're all right. There's nothing there. That player's killing me. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 51:56

So that's a challenge. That's what you love.

SPEAKER_01 51:58

Yeah, and I like the challenge. But sometimes when you have great coaches and good coaches that love that challenge and they can't, they can't overcome their own stupidity or arrogance to think they could change a kid, that affects the that affects the team. It affects everything else because now you're dealing with that, you know, one or two parents. Like I'll tell you, like I had a group of parents a couple of years ago that had the defensive alliance. Like they would all, like they're all colluding together that, you know, and calling me out on on the way we were playing, uh, because they felt empowered that they were aligned. I'm like, well, I'm aligned, like I'm aligned with you. Like, I want to coach your team. Why come I can't be on the defensive alliance? Like, why can't I be a part of that that group? Right. Like, you're the head coach, you're the enemy. I'm like, am I the enemy of your kid? I said, I want your kids to succeed. So I think it's it all depends. Be careful what you wish for. You know, sometimes you take players, um, and again, you could be on this, you could be listening to this right now. You might be one of those parents. You might be one of those parents that coach is like, like, I don't know, I don't really want to take that kid because you know, mom and dad come with a lot of baggage, and I love the kid, but this is gonna this is not gonna end well for me. And then, you know, my problem is I'm always the person that says, Well, I yeah, that's no problem. I can handle that parent. No problem at all. And then I'm sitting there in in December going, God damn it, I can't believe I did it didn't work. You know, so I think it's so but I but I do I listen to your point with the with your three, you know, the things you look for, right? And I and I I I probably look for very similar stuff. Like just I love coaches that had compassion, like that generally went out of their way to love. And and a lot of times it's it's a parent. A lot of times I was a parent coach, like somebody that really went out of their way and said, Oh my god, I can't believe how great you did last week. And I can't believe, you know, what an effort you put in. And that was so much fun to watch what you did. And I think, you know, knowing and somebody that that was consistent, like always somebody that you always knew they were getting there. You always, and then you know, when you're a kid, like that's why great, it's great that parents are part of this process, right? Because when you're an eight-year-old, you have no idea how hard it was for that other that coach to get to practice. But you're like, what do you mean? They got off a plane at three o'clock and they were practice today at six, right? How is that possible? Like, like parents, parents need to know that. Or, oh my God, that person, do you know that coach, their kid?

SPEAKER_00 54:13

Communication. We're coming back to it again.

SPEAKER_01 54:16

You know what? If you communicate, so you know, that coach that you know, his kid's sick and he's the head coach, but he still shows up, like and his kid's not even there for two weeks. Like, like to me, those are the kind of people that I'm like, wow, you know what? This person's really committed to me. I'm I want to commit to them. And parents, the one thing, the one thing, and I know we have to end this here, the one thing I would say when you're choosing your coach or looking to place your kid in the right environment, the more you can do to make that environment better, it's going to make your environment better. Like, the more you try to help that coach, and I don't mean, you know, help them by like, you know, slipping them a couple of bucks so your kid plays more. It's the more you can help and say, hey, coach, anything I could do this weekend? You know, anything I can help you with? Hey, can I can I take care of the pucks for you every week? Hey, can I can I make sure the water bottles are on the bench? Hey, do you need you need somebody to organize, you know, uh the scorekeeping and in the away travel? Like the more you can do to benefit and help that coach, can I be the locker room attendant for this weekend? Like the more you can do to squash the this the dissension on little tiny things, the more you're gonna have a great experience for your kid.

SPEAKER_00 55:23

It's culture.

SPEAKER_01 55:24

Right, but just but it's so hard. People just don't know.

SPEAKER_00 55:27

They don't I'll tell you, look, I'm gonna I'm gonna again, I'm not trying to keep using my own experience. That's all I have, right? Uh, just a wonderful example of what you're talking about, Mike. All right. Uh, we've talked about this on the show all season that the off-ice team building we have been doing has been with two teams that practice together. It could be call them A B, whatever. They have color codes, but they're two teams. We merged them together at off ice. And this past weekend, there was a situation where basically they were all playing together and it was seamless and it was beautiful. There was no problem. The culture was there, the parents were there, they were all happy. What a success. We didn't even win the game, and I didn't care because I could see it. What a wonderful experience for these kids. They're hugging each other. Or the other day I ran my last office of the season, all the kids on the team, two teams, arms around each other, singing on the way back to the rink after the event. And I remember thinking, we did it. We did it, we did what we wanted to do today or this year. All right. I I just we're missing that too much in sports, not even just hockey. So if you find an organization that your kids smiling and singing at the end of the year, you can stay with those people, which I wish we did more of, Mike, going back to your point about the hockey factors. I wish we did more, you know, two to five year cycles. We don't. Um it'd be beneficial.

SPEAKER_01 56:48

Um unless you're good enough to get recruited by the top team and down the street, then go to them.

SPEAKER_00 56:52

Then go to them. Just jump ship. Yeah. I'm sure it'll be great.

SPEAKER_01 56:56

Because it's gonna work for your kid.

SPEAKER_00 56:58

It's gonna just you're gonna be the one. Yeah, you're the one. Anyway, listen to all the parents listening, all the coaches listening, uh, really wishing you the best uh in the offseason. I I know this is a turbulent time. We know evaluations have probably happened by the time you listen to this, and there's a lot of anxiety. Yeah, we get it, we get it, right? It's part of the process, but just know this. It it's very rare. This is important to say, it's very rare that one season makes or breaks your kids' entire hockey experience lifetime. All right, there are important seasons. All right. Anyone whose kids are junior in high school or senior, I get it. I do. Those are tough, okay. Especially if you're trying to play at the next level, it's not easy. All right. But if you're uh squirt, pee-wee, might, Adam, even bantam, I promise you, next season's not gonna make or break your kids' entire career, uh, most likely. All right. And it's so important that wherever you end up, Mike, and I'm gonna let you talk of this too, real quick. Wherever you end up, you need to make the best of it. You need to do, I wrote this note and I forgot to say it earlier. I think one of the most important questions you can ask your family, your kid, is what you're gonna do when you're not at practice. What amount of time are you gonna put in, player X, when you're not at practice? Are is your kid the kid who is practicing in the garage or finding a private coach or doing something to continually learn? Because at the end of the day, friends, that's what's gonna make the difference. The kid that puts in the time and is dedicated and gets good grades and is working on this constantly, away from their five or six hours with the team a week, that is probably the kid that's gonna succeed long term. It's not just the coach. All right? What's that line from Hamilton? I'm just like my country, I'm young, scrappy, hungry. Like that's it's gotta be like that.

SPEAKER_01 58:52

It might come as a shock to all of us in the coaching profession, but we have so little to do with where a player ends up that we're all we're doing is like like sweeping off the path when they're getting there and saying, oh, or or throwing some gravel on. Say that's pass too easy for you. Throw a little gravel on there and then let them slip and slide, and then and then sweep it off again and say, ooh, ooh, you're doing great. Put a little gravel on. Like all we're doing is is is pushing and pulling and and and guiding, but really we have such little impact on where your player is going to go in the long term. It's there, it's them. It's it's it's in that. And if it's not there, and it's our job to to bring it out, we could squash it. We know that. We already know we could we can crush a player. We know that. And I've probably done that. And I and I I can't tell you.

SPEAKER_00 59:45

I think we all have. And I think every coach has done that at some point.

SPEAKER_01 59:48

Did I miss that? Like, how did I miss that? Like, or or wow, that was that a mistake. And or when I was young, you know, but are but your your your drive your child's path has l so much less to do with a coach developing them, but it has a lot to do with a coach crushing them. So just understand that put them with good people, put them in a great environment, put them in a place where you feel safe and they feel safe, and you can look and you're not sitting by yourself and everybody's you know putting daggers in your back. Just just be in a really good place and your kids are gonna flourish. And if they're if they're gonna be great, they're gonna be great, and they're gonna be great. I mean, the the people I hated the most were those kids that did nothing, nothing, and were better than me. I'm like, God damn it, you know, how does this kid do nothing and he's still great?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:34

That's why we're that's why we're coaches.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:36

That's who they are. That's who that player is. So I don't know. Like I said, I think that's the cautionary tale is that your players are gonna get to where they're gonna get. And and you can you can you have a much better chance of of killing that than than than build in my in my what I've seen, then encouraging it. It's it's it's almost better to sit back, let them develop, let them have fun, let don't don't get in their way, and you know, and just listen, just find good people, and then when you find good people, cherish, cherish that, you know, yeah, like really, really encourage that and say, come back, please, another year. Because we loved my kid loved coming to the rink every day with you.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:15

Yeah, that's some prolific points there, Mike. And you you'll all notice that uh in our in our kind of qualifications for great coaching, we didn't talk about qualifications. We didn't want to, oh, you gotta find a person with 20 years experience or a level five coaching certification. Mike's saying it right, find good people, you will have a good process, right? I think like that's what we should leave it on. Is is it comes down to the people, comes down to the person, and you'll know. So, hey, great discussion today, Mike. And again, I for those of you listening, I know sometimes we get off on tangents, but what hockey conversation doesn't. And uh always appreciate you listening. Um, I hope we we did answer the question of just kind of finding the right coach for your kid. We definitely covered a lot. So um, thank you for listening. And again, just so you know, again, we're in the springtime here, we're gonna be with you all spring, all summer, like we normally do. We have some really great guests coming up on both Our Kids Play Hockey and Our Kids Play Goalie. Uh, in the summer months, we try and fill it in with uh with the NHL players when they're not playing the game. So that's gonna happen as well. Uh, and remember to check out our kidsplayhockey.com uh for all the episodes, for our gift giving guide, for anything you need. There's a lot there. Uh and finally, if you haven't already, a lot of people have been diving into our uh private Facebook group, Our Kids Play Hockey. A couple yes-no questions to get in, and you join the community kind of a back channel uh to this and uh find out when new episodes are released, so forth and so on. But for Mike Benelli, I'm Leah Lyons. You've been listening to Our Kids Play Hockey, talk about coaching qualifications. They write for my kid. We'll see you next week on Our Kids Play Hockey. Have a great one, everybody. We hope you enjoyed this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. Make sure to like and subscribe right now if you found value wherever you're listening, whether it's a podcast network, a social media network, or our website, ourkidsplayhockey.com. Also, make sure to check out our children's book, When Hockey Stops, at WhenHockeStops.com. It's a book that helps children deal with adversity in the game and in life. We're very proud of it. But thanks so much for listening to this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey, and we'll see you on the next episode.