Pavel Barber (Part 2): Why Slowing Down Is the Fastest Way to Get Better at Hockey

SPEAKER_03 1:23

Hello hockey friends and families around the world. Welcome back to our Kids Play Hockey Part 2 with Pablo Barber. If you haven't heard part one, go back and listen to that first. Let's get you right back in that episode right now. And I remember the first time I pulled off a tow drag in an open hockey, because that's where it was I was trying it. And it took kids, you're gonna laugh at me. It took everything I had. Everything I had. Focus, everything to pull this off. And I remember pulling it off and knowing I could do it after that. And I was a teenager when this happened. I've got to specify again, this was not a common move back then. All right. But you know what we didn't have, we didn't have somebody we first off, we didn't have the internet really, we didn't have YouTube. I didn't have someone showing me things were possible. The best part of hockey, in my opinion, outside the uh life skills that you build from it, all right. That is by far the most important aspect of it. But as we teach kids to dream in an environment we just talked about this too, where failing is kind of part of it, right? We say all the time, like really, when you think about coaching hockey, the whole game is based off capitalizing on failure, right? Like that's that's the chess match of hockey. And you're you're helping kids dream, all right? So I wanted to pay you that compliment because I don't think we talk about that a lot. Of I we see it now, it's possible. We talk about the first person who ran the mile in under four minutes or minutes, right? Roger Bannister. Like you're trailblazing in that way. Um, and I do think that uh going broader, you know, that's one of the cool things about YouTube and social media is that we get to see these things. We can't obsess to them to the point that's all we're thinking about. All right, but uh look, I wanted to pay you that compliment. There's a question here, I promise.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Well, yeah, we echoed that compliment.

SPEAKER_03 3:18

I I had to say that. When I was growing up, man, I was I was looking for inspiration anywhere, uh, you know, to to learn something. And and you're doing that. Now, this is where I want to segue with this, though. Okay. And I I I really applaud you for saying on the air, oh yeah, no, I don't do these things on the first take all the time. Right? Because I think it's important for kids to hear that. It's not like you just wake up and go, all right, yeah, I'm gonna do uh 15 things around my body and flip it up, catch it, and throw it. Like that's not how this works for you. Talk to me about the discipline and that process of how you approach any skill, not just the moves, right? Of how you approach, you know, really harnessing a skill or perfecting a skill or mastering. That's the word I'm looking for. Mastering a skill. Because I I think it's important that the kids hear this that you know, when Pablo Barber wakes up, it's not just, I mean, you've got skill sets built up, but no, there's work that goes into these things. And I want you to imprint that on these kids right now.

SPEAKER_01 4:15

Yeah, you know, I think uh the discipline is being patient and going slow. Uh, number one, understanding like your foundation skills are gonna build all the skills you build on top of it. So, like your ability to stick handle the puck off the body, look up, uh shift your body weight left and right, uh, and keep the puck moving forward off your body as you're going. Like, that's your foundational stick handling or puck control skill set uh that you're gonna build everything else. So make sure that foundation is built solid and you're you're not like stopping working on those. You never stop working on the basics, you always continue to work on them. Uh, you look at Crosby the way he warms up, he's always doing the most basic stuff. Yeah, but you have to. That's how he's the most consistent player of our game. 20, what is it, 20 seasons with uh more than the point a game? That's what it takes. That's captain consistency right there. But uh, you know, I think the biggest thing is the patience and the process of progression. So, you know, when you get better at a skill, it's it's so attractive to rush because you want to get to that end goal, you want to do things fast, you want to do things hard, you want to do things that you know the best ability, but you you've got to be patient because you've got to have awareness over the the parts in that skill set you're trying to form where you're lacking, uh, right? So, and you want to build consistency as well. So, I always teach kids like you know, we walk before we run. So, a lot of the off-ice stuff. At my camps, we actually do off-ice stuff with green biscuits stationary. So we build that, like, you know, what are we doing with our hands, right? What do we do with our body to go through a move? What are the technical aspects of on a backhand toe drag? I gotta raise my top hand and rotate it. We do all that stuff slowly, standing still, away from the ice, just with a green biscuit, all the technical stuff slow. We get to the ice, we've got that foundation, that understanding of what we got to do. Now we're adding movement. Uh, when we add movement, we add slow movement, we're moving very slow uh with some edge work, and then maybe picking it up moving fast. And that's gonna depend on the level you're at. My biggest uh advice would be be very patient and go very slow and be very honest with yourself where you're at with the skill. This is where comparisons will kill you. Like, don't look at Johnny and what he can do. It doesn't matter, it doesn't mean you won't catch up to him. He might be ahead of you. Don't think you've got to rush your process. You're gonna get if you rush that process, if you're not well practiced and consistent within a skill, there's no rushing it, it just does not exist. You've got to go slow, develop a deep understanding, walk first, and then run. And there, that's why I always tell kids like, do you have a stick handling area at home? It could be a carpet floor and a golf ball. Do not underestimate that. You can build a ton of skill with very, very little stuff uh at home and build those reps in. Uh, and then when you get to the ice, now we're adding movement, now we're multitasking, right? We're skating and we're doing the moves, and then we're gonna have to work on like synchronizing the movements with the skating and doing all that stuff. So go slow first, I would say.

SPEAKER_03 7:23

You know, I I gotta say this, Pablo. We we've discussed this for again years on the show of the question of okay, why are kids putting themselves in these positions with skills on the ice in games? I I actually think you might have uncovered the answer to that question here because the typical assumption is well, they're watching everybody on social media, and that's why they're doing all these things. And I do think on the surface that is part of it. You just mentioned that as well. But you you talked about the the rushing. Um, and I think parents for the parents listening and the coaches, right? We are living in this kind of immediate gratification time period. And I I think you've just uncovered it, man, of like we're not reminding kids, and I said remind, I don't mean telling, yelling. We're not reminding kids of hey, patience. You gotta work on this away from the rink. I love that you said that. You know, one of the things I encourage coaches to do, and kids too, when you think about the surfaces we play on, right? On the ice, skating is uh the one skill that it cannot be uh exactly uh uh uh you know done off the ice, right? There's uh there's I know we can rollerblade, but ice skating is ice skating, right? Uh there's no 100% thing there. Off the ice, though, you can really work on your hands, right? To to almost a near identical effect. I understand we're taking the ice away with the motions, the movements, you can work on those a little differently. So there is an ecosystem here that as parents and as coaches, we have to create physically and mentally. Physically is under having the kids understand you can do this away from the ring. I try and tell all the kids I coach 10, you said it, 10 minutes a day minimum, off the ice with a golf ball, wooden ball, green biscuit, whatever, will do wonders for your game over one season. All right, and then mentally slow it down. You don't need to be able to Michigan tomorrow, right? Work on that after your 10 minutes of puck handling. Work on that slowly, pick it up, figure it out. I think we're not because because let's be honest, adults, we want immediate gratification too. We don't we we don't get off the hook with this, all right? Maybe we need to work on the environment a little more than we're working on the the here's what you need to do. You want to win, listen to me.

SPEAKER_01 9:42

Yeah, I think yeah, exactly that. Like, you know, we we have to understand, like, these kids are growing up in an age where that's what they know, that's their normal is immediate gratification, right? Like I grew up there, I didn't have a cell phone until I was like 19. Uh I'm very glad I didn't. Uh, you know, you you you learn like everything that's gonna lead to like uh long-term growth in in life or in hockey is always delayed gratification. These things do take a lot of time uh and and patience. And yeah, just getting that across to kids, there's a that there's that uh and to get out of the mindset of like I need to know this now uh is is so crucial. But you set up little checkpoints as well, right? Where it's like, you know, I I see players like think, like, oh, like I don't have the skill yet, it's taken so long. It's like, well, you've hit some checkpoints and you haven't celebrated any of them, right? Like there's little bits of progression along the way and they need to be celebrated, or else we're just chasing that dangling carrot forever, right? Like it's it's okay to not have the skill, but it's to say I've gotten a lot better, you know, and I've I've made improvements, and I I promise you, like it'll it'll click out of nowhere where where things just happen. Where if you're you know patient enough and you focus on your fundamentals first and you work a little bit on the extra skills and stuff like that, you work enough, the stuff just clicks and your brain just fires and it it wires, and it's just like you you get these skills, and you now you could do them looking around you and stuff like that, and it'll happen a little bit out of nowhere, but yeah, it's all built off of your 10 minutes plus of work you put away uh from the ice and and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_03 11:24

Well, it it's like that 10,000 hour rule, and and you know, I I'm gonna say this and then we'll probably go into your athletic life a little bit too. Um, but one of the things I try and tell kids is like you know, that 10,000 hour rule is that after about 10,000 hours, you've built up enough school uh sorry, tool sets, some magical things start to happen. And I think I I'm gonna ask you this question, right? When when you do create a new uh we'll just you move, right? Something, right? Uh, do you think kids realize that the new move, quote unquote, is actually the collaboration of 50 other moves coming together that you've mastered to put that move into place? You know what I'm saying? Can you can you expand on that a little bit?

SPEAKER_01 12:07

Yeah, I mean, yeah, there's no way they can know for sure so that, but definitely that's what it is. I mean, like me being able to like catch the the puck out of the air and toe drag it out of the air. Uh, obviously there's hand eye involved in that, but a lot of that's just like knowing how much I need to rotate my blade, uh, how long I need to stay on that puck because it can't be long. I gotta immediately catch that and then you know turn it over so I can keep the puck on the blade. So a lot of that is just built off of the understanding of the progressions I've already been through is like how much do I need to rotate my blade, how much time do I need to spend on this blade, what angle do I need to drag this puck on to keep it on the blade? So like it's it's always funny. Like, I never only I separate my hay barber from Pavel Barber training, like professional from like entertainment, but a lot of those things are intertwined in in terms of like I learned a lot of that skills that you wouldn't use in games, and I never advise you do, like catching a puck out of the air and toe dragging, obviously, not useful in a game, just for fun. And I try and emphasize that, but I'm only able to do that because I'm well practiced in the fundamentals of the other stuff. So definitely that stuff comes a lot easier, having really put a lot of time into the basics of hockey and understanding of just blade rotation timing, spacing, all that stuff.

SPEAKER_02 13:28

It was funny. We uh during COVID, we uh bunch of the kids I worked with, we did a um like a Pavel Barber skills challenge every week, right? It was really it was really more like okay, watch a video and then let's see if you can uh you know rotate the rotate the puck and keep it on your stick. Let's watch a video and let's see if you can flip, turn around, and catch it. Uh how can you flip the puck up, flip your stick over and catch it? And it was and I think the the vehicle for a lot of that was boredom. It was the fact that these things you were so bored. I think when I grew up, like I was the only kid on my, you know, uh at 14 years old that could take the puck and do a 360 with the puck on my stick in the air because I worked at a pro shop that nobody ever went to, and all I did all day was handle the puck on my stick. So can you talk a little bit about you know where that comes from for you growing up? And and and you you mentioned, you know, not I I think it's an underappreciated thing for parents to know that you don't, and again, we're not trying to uh take any money out anybody's pocket here, but you don't need to go to the rink to train, you don't need to go to the specialist to get better, you don't need to go to a uh a session where you're focused on one skill. A lot of it is boredom. It's being creative in your own environment and then coming up with your own tools. And I think you've done that across, I mean, I've seen you in in inline hockey, I've seen you in obviously in floorball, I've seen you in ice hockey, we've seen you in in uh in uh you know dressing up as a in a gag costume and doing all of these things all around the fact that you're like, okay, well, I'm gonna try it, but I'm not gonna sit on an Xbox all day and do it. I'm actually gonna physically go do this, and I don't have the money to go travel to downtown Toronto to go to a specialist. You just talk about you know how parents can um, you know, when they see that in a player, like don't always jump to, oh, I gotta get this kid a specialist. Let them be bored, let them explore, and and and if they have to sit there and and and be uh, you know, they're not they're not finding that success right away, let them wallow in that a little bit. Like, don't don't don't don't save them yet.

SPEAKER_01 15:42

Yeah, that's that's a great, great point. I mean, I always tell parents like, you know, I do private lessons, but it's like your kid's gonna only go so far as uh the work they put away from me uh and their team. You know, uh so much of your development is on you uh and individual to you. And that's we don't see that on video. Like I've had many discussions with NHL players to know this pretty pretty well, but like, you know, their biggest development was done with them being aware of the stuff they needed to work on, and a lot of times working on it away from skills coaches and and teams. You know, that that's where you build player identity, that's where you're able to refine the skills that are brushed on uh lightly in team training. Uh and and to no fault of coaches, like you know, when you do a team training, you've got to generalize it, you've got to do systems work, you've got that stuff so important, but the skill sets within the systems are also important. I think the balance could be better on some teams. You need both, uh, both are super important, but uh a lot of that's gonna be on your own time. So uh, you know, I I like to tell parents as well, like, you know, when a kid's doing a trick shot or something like that, ask yourself, is that coming at the expense of training and working on other stuff? So online, you'll you'll see it all the time where parents get upset that kids are just doing trick shots, this and that. And I I don't doubt that's true for some kids. But the worst place to go uh to see where the game is going is to social media, which is a you know a platform developed for entertainment purposes where new stuff always gets views and things. So you're gonna see stuff that isn't the fundamentals, the important stuff, the off-the-wall work and hockey. You're not gonna see it uh online, it's not gonna go viral. So that's not a good place to go. But really encourage kids to do trick shots if they love it, and if that means they'll work longer on the ice at the important stuff. And that's what I did growing up. Like I loved working on just basic stuff, like just stick handling head up, doing crossovers with the puck, doing cutback moves, directional changes. I would do all that stuff for like 90% of my time on rollerblades or on ice when we had the outdoor rings, and then 10% of it I'd mix in between trick shots because it was fun. It kept me rejuvenated because it was like, man, it's a little boring and monotonous working on these uh these other skills that are so much more important. But it's like mix in some trick shots, whatever you need to do to keep your brain like this is fun. I can stay out here instead of for 45 minutes locked in. I can be out here for two friggin' hours locked in if I mix in some trick shots and some Zoros and whatever. So, again, it only becomes an issue if that trick shot stuff comes at the expense of the actual in-game uh applied moves, right? You have to really look at the whole of what they're doing. And what really bugs me is online, like Trevor Ziegress gets uh nailed for this because he's he scored four Michigans. So people make the assumption that this guy's just behind the net ripping mishies for like an hour every day. You don't know anything about what this guy's doing. I don't know anything. I can guarantee you he's not doing Michigans for an hour, but like people like to you know make these like very oversimplified, like because this guy does some trick shots or trick shots Michigans, whatever, that's what we'll label him as, and that's what we'll we'll say his shortcomings are for. When in reality it's like, well, you know, he needed to work on getting off the wall and his his work around the net a little bit better, but I guarantee you he wasn't just that wasn't because he could Michigan, but right he's he's a great example, actually, Pavel.

SPEAKER_03 19:31

Because again, for people outside Philadelphia, I probably haven't seen this clip, but there's a great clip of the head coach Rick Tocket talking to him about hey, are you just a social media guy or are you like a real hockey player? And Ziegress says like that conversation really hit him in a positive way that you know he says, I don't want to be known for just the Michigan. He said that I that's not how I want to be remembered. Now he's leading the team in points. Yeah, right. So so you're a hundred percent right about that. I've always said the trick shots to me because I do them, right? They're it's like dessert, yeah. You got to get the protein, you got to get the good food in you first. Then please have some dessert, right? Like, like uh I think that's really important. Um, listen, we we gotta show I want to give some time to you being not just a world-class person, but a world world class athlete um because you have represented Canada in floorball on the international stage multiple times. And look, we're big fans of floorball on this show, um, not just as a development tool for hockey, but as a sport. Um, and again, for those of you who don't know, floorball is an incredibly popular sport overseas, especially in Scandinavia. Um, and you have played at the absolute highest level of that sport. Let's talk really quick about how you landed yourself on Team Canada. I mean, obviously you have to make that team, is what I'm trying to say, right? Um, and then what is international competition like in that sport? Uh, you know, because I I think it's it's uh undersold how how great of a game floorball is.

SPEAKER_01 20:56

Oh yeah. So I think uh it would have been 2015. I got the offer to try out for Team Canada for the uh it was the world championships in uh I believe it was Latvia, uh where they had the first ones I played at. Uh and yeah, I I went, I had played ball hockey a lot. I was currently actually just retired from field hockey. I played that for Team Canada before.

SPEAKER_03 21:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 21:20

So those kind of go hand in hand. I I had a floorball stick since I was, I want to say, probably like 13 years old or something, just messing around at home. So I had had some experience with it. And when I got in the triads or whatever, I I had a pretty good tryout. I was lucky to be partnered with a guy. His name's Valtory, he plays in the top league in Finland now. So I just I always say I'm just I'm riding his coattails and I just uh do all the little things right, uh, just put the ball in the back of the net and work off him. But yeah, I tried out made that team, and then ever since have been uh yeah on Team Canada for that. And you know, I think floorball has so many developmental opportunities for hockey. I wouldn't say like I would advise way more like roller hockey and just off-ice work with a puck than I would floorball for actual skills development. I think for the systems and working off off of players in a five-on-five environment and being able to have softer hands because that ball and stick are very light, floorball is very good for that. The pace of play is like three times faster just because that ball moves so quickly. You've got to know where that next play is immediately before you get it. So teaching those skills of scanning to see where that option is before the ball gets there, running an open space because time and space closes down so quick, moving off your checks, working within the system where you're constantly moving and trying to time when those passes go to get to that slot area, whatever it is, those are so unbelievably applicable uh to hockey. And speaking from Team Canada standpoint, we're like not even close to the tops in the world. If you if you watch Sweden or Finland, like they would spank us, and their skills are nuts. Like, I think Finland had faced um the Finnish national ice hockey team once and they crushed them uh at floor ball. So it's definitely it's not a one to one ice hockey to floor ball. Floor ball's prohibitive. But my God, it is such a A fast-paced, fun, and incredibly physical sport. Like people look at it and they're like, oh, that's like the soft version of hockey. Like, yeah, it's not full contact. Don't get me wrong, it's not as tough as hockey by any means. But these guys at the top level are crushing each other over the boards nonstop. There's the loose 50-50 ball battles are intense. Uh and yeah, just a very fun, fast paced, a good sport for like the mental side being able to process information faster for sure.

SPEAKER_00 23:44

And Pavel, there's so much uh specialization going on now in in youth sports. You see it. Um, and it's not just hockey. Are are you someone who encourages parents and coaches to make sure that kids have interests outside of one sport?

SPEAKER_01 24:06

Oh, absolutely. Um, one sport or one activity, like it could be playing guitar or or something like that. Just something to give them a little bit of a break from the sport they're playing. Uh, I like multi-sport for the purpose of like with hockey, we're a lot of emphasis on our abductors, adductors, groin, hip flexors, all that. Playing a sport like floorball or soccer, where you're working on muscle groups you wouldn't otherwise train actually helps you to be preventative for injuries and things like that and just use them in different ways. Uh, but I also just think it's so good just for like understanding, like in soccer, it's so good. I'm terrible at soccer, but uh like how your how your feet have to move, right? Like controlling your footwork. So your footwork on the ice will probably improve if you play a sport where you're playing like soccer or something like that. Um, you know, and any sport that is has like multiple people on where you're having to find open space, make passes, and move off each other is beneficial as well, just from a positioning standpoint. Uh, but I think just anything to give kids a bit of a break uh from it and work on something outside of that sport is is incredibly beneficial. Like some of the best kids I train play the piano really well or guitar really well or have some other hobby, and it's cool because that's their break. If if they're like running wild nonstop on the ice like five times a week, they probably can't have another sport in that time frame, maybe in the summer, but you know, if you're you need a bit of a break uh physically uh as well, so it's so important.

SPEAKER_02 25:39

Yeah, it allows you, it allows you to have that uh the the ability to if you're mentally tough, right? And you're you want to learn the guitar, you have to be mentally tough. Like you can't just give up after a day. He's like, I can't play any guitar. Well, you've been trying for 15 minutes. I mean, I think it's like the same thing when you see high performers, and especially like the people you're around at the at the pro level, they're high performers in a lot of things, right? They're not just high performers in in hockey. That was obviously the sport they love, but most of those, to Christy's point, like when you see these multi-sport or they call them multi-sport athletes, they're just great athletes. There are people that could go into another sport, baseball, tennis, golf, and they excel at it because they they have the discipline to say, okay, here's how I want to do it. Here's how I here's the fundamentals around it, and then I'm gonna practice it in the right way so that I can excel at this, not because I want to be a great golfer, it's because inherently in their DNA is they have to be a great golfer, like it's just something they have to do.

SPEAKER_01 26:38

Yeah, yeah. I mean, that's like that's that's like a perfect, like like for me, I played multiple sports and whatever because I just loved doing it, but I always found it was so good because going from hockey, you take that same framework for progression and you just apply it to another sport. So, like when I first tried out for field hockey team can, I got cut three years in a row before I finally made it on my fourth. And those three years, you were you were it was a new sport for me. I picked up a stick at like 18 for the first time and made the team at I think it was 22 finally. And you learn, you're just like, what the key skills I gotta work on. And I would I knew I was gonna be a basic player because that was the only way I was gonna make it because I was so many years behind. So I was thinking, like, I gotta be the in the best shape. It's just the only way. And I've gotta have my basics, my first touch on the ball right, my passes right. I'm gonna be a forward, so I gotta learn the spacing where I gotta be, all that stuff. So I did all the little things uh well. But like I remember having a notepad that would I would put all my progressional notes in, like when I was doing a reverse stick pass, which is crazy. Like you hit it and then you hit it with the shaft of the stick, the ball goes. So you have to learn to hit a nice flat pass like that, and it just looks weird. And I had a notepad where I would like uh look at the angle of my blade and be like, this is the angle I need to get it. This is where my top hand has to be, so I knew those like points would stick. But that would it was the same process for understanding how to do moves in hockey, it right? It's like go slow, understand those things, and when you we when you build a bit of consistency, like write it down so that you can always revisit that point of like, you know, this is what I need to do. I have the same with tennis in my notepad, like hitting a one-hander, it's like you gotta make sure you go through it, and then the the the backhand has to go back, so you create some balance there, whatever it is. You just write that stuff down, and yeah, just keep going through the progressions.

SPEAKER_03 28:33

You know, I gotta say this, Pablo, again. For those of you listening, like takeaways from the episode. Every time you talk about a sport or a skill, the way you speak about it. I don't know if you hear yourself talking, right? But the way you speak about it is is is that obsession, like that that is exactly why you are who you are, right? Because you have that ability to say, let me break this down, let me write this down, let me obsess in a positive way over how to develop uh X, Y, and Z. If you played piano, I guarantee you you'd say you talk about piano the exact same way. You talk about floorball, uh uh um field hockey, tennis, uh, ice hockey, it doesn't matter, right? Because that's who you are. Now, I wanted to say this, and Mike, you spawned this too, right? I think that I'll say aside from love of a game, you have to have the love of the game if you want to succeed, love of anything, right? But the biggest transferable, the most valuable transferable skill, and it is a skill between sports or activities is what you're doing here, Pavel, which is the ability to obsess and learn and grind its grit. Okay? And uh if you have grit for hockey, you can apply that grit to other things. Like I think about myself, like when I write, like I'm a I'm a writer, like the amount of studying I do on how to write better or the practicing of writing, people don't see the stuff I don't put out.

unknown 30:02

Right?

SPEAKER_03 30:03

Uh you know, uh I broadcasting, like all the things we do successfully were were positive. I want to say positively obsessing, because obsessing sometimes has a negative connotation to it, but over the process. And kids listen, we'll talk about this too on the right of the ring. But that grit, that ability, Mike, you said it to say, oh, I I it's been 15 minutes on the guitar and I suck. I'm not doing this. You've got to develop the skill of, oh no, it's only been 15 minutes, I need 15 years, and I gotta work at this if I really want to do it, right? Any pro athlete I've ever met, any pro at anything I've ever met, pro has that. Pavel, you don't just walk on to the an international floorball team and a field hockey team just because of your skill alone. I appreciate how humble and Canadian you're being about this. I have joking there, but like you and your ability to learn, you who who is very well established in ice hockey, saying, I want to learn this and I want to do this. Oh, and by the way, I didn't make the team the first time. And I'm not the best at this. That mentality of I'm gonna fail and I'm gonna get better, and then I'm gonna try again. Kids, listening, parents, coaches, all it's a it's not just kids. That's that I there's the rub, right? That's the magic sauce mixed in with the patience. I think we've uncovered a lot in this episode today. Um, I I do.

SPEAKER_02 31:29

It's such a because it's so humbling, right? It's so humbling to fail. It's it's so humbling to like me. Like I don't write, uh, you know, because I'm not me, me not good writer sometimes. So it's like sometimes to me, it's it's like one of those things where if you can humble yourself to to to allow yourself to say, well, I'm gonna fail. I know it. I'm gonna go in there and I'm gonna find the secrets like it's like so we hear about everybody. You know, why do you become a great shooting coach? You go to a bunch of goalie clinics. How do you become a great defensive player? You go to a lot of offensive camps, like like humble yourself to be a learner and be somebody that wants to embrace uh having the opportunity to try something outside of sport, no matter what it is. But it it takes it's such a risky thing for people to do to go do that because everybody else is looking at you, and you have to be able to watch. I mean, and that's why I think you I mean, personally, that's why I see your successes like you don't give a crap what other people are looking at. I'm sure people used to look at you at the park downtown, like, what the hell is this guy doing? Just turn it away, just turn it away.

SPEAKER_01 32:32

Half and half of development is uh yeah, go ahead, Pavel.

SPEAKER_00 32:35

Go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 32:35

I'm sorry, I was gonna say, like, half of development is ego maintenance, right? It's just like letting that go. It's like I have it, like I definitely feel like where it's like, oh, like you feel like people saying stuff or whatever. It's not like it doesn't exist, but it's maintenance of it. It's it's understanding like you're gonna have to look stupid, you're gonna have to try new stuff, you're gonna have to fail. And it's it's always your relationship with failure that's gonna determine how far you go in sport. Uh, as we we've talked about here, it's the more you fail, the more you correct, the more you get better, the more consistent you get. But it's that ego gets in the way. Uh, that ego that says, you know, don't mess this up, that ego that says they're they're all looking at you, that ego that says, you know, we need to be a hundred percent right right or do this, or we need to have this skill now. Like the ego maintenance side is is gonna be uh a deterrent uh if if you're allowing that ego to constantly or I just want to learn. Like if you if you're gonna learn something, and that's why I always encourage people, like just listen to the pros. Like these are guys who made it, they are saying they failed millions of times, they look stupid so often. Like I've seen John Tavares in practice five years ago going through a certain different skill set he was working on. He looked like a little new to hockey because he was going through something that was like very, very challenging, right? Like, I'm not saying he looked bad, but it's like that's what's gonna happen when you do anything new. It's not gonna look good. Uh, you can be a pro, whatever. So just like you know, let the ego go a bit. Like, don't worry so much about what people say or think about you. It's easier to do on your own, but even when you get in that team environment, like you know, in one-on-ones, like if you're trying to be a hundred percent successful, you're gonna take no risk, right? And you're gonna be subjected to playing minim a minimized role as you get older because you're not getting the the leash because you never get results because you never took the risk to begin with, right? So like turnover rates are always highest for the highest goal scores, they fail more, like David turns the poke over a lot, uh, more than like a fourth-blind guy. Yeah, but he also scores more, right? Right. So it's like these successful guys they succeed more because they fail more, not in spite of it.

SPEAKER_03 34:52

Maybe we we should make a channel called FailTube and just show all of the best players with all of their mistakes every game. Oh, it would yeah, that'd be great. That would that we maybe that's something we should be doing here. Is like here's the 37 mistakes from the top 15 players in the NHL tonight, uh, for you to learn from this. Um, that would be a that would be a a good exploration of ego and humbling. Uh Pavel, I do want to ask you this. Sorry, um, we talked about other activities and things like that. What does Pavla Barber do to relax away from the rink? What it is it like you pour yourself a cup of tea, sit down with a good book by a fireplace. What what are the things that you do, you know, when you're not when you're not working?

SPEAKER_01 35:34

Uh yeah, I mean I I read a fair bit for sure. Um I right now I'm like building a hockey course, so I do a ton of editing. Uh I'm doing like uh this is like half half of it right here, just like videos I gotta I gotta complete and edit and all this stuff. Uh I love doing it, it's so fun. Um, but it's time consuming. Uh video games with buddies for sure. I love doing that. Just like that's our way of just catching up with each other. We play a video game, just chat, uh, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_03 36:05

But uh I gotta ask you what games do you play?

SPEAKER_01 36:08

Oh, we we play like we play a bit of chell, we play a bit of Fortnite, we play uh yeah, like Call of Duty.

SPEAKER_03 36:15

What is your Fortnite skin right now?

SPEAKER_01 36:18

Well, right now it's a Christmas tree because of Christmas. Uh before that I was Homer Simpson because Big Simpsons fan.

SPEAKER_03 36:24

There you go. Yeah, yeah, we'll talk about that.

SPEAKER_00 36:26

Speaking of editing, Pavel, I do have to compliment your videos. Um, they're shot, they're edited, and they're just amazing to watch. So there's a lot of skill in just putting your your videos together that that we follow along. I, you know, I'm friends with you on Facebook. I'm I'm watching, I can't wait to see what you do next. But what I also have to compliment you on, and this is kind of a hard thing to do, is you feel the joy. It just comes across on the screen. You capture that beautifully. So I do, I just want hats off to you and your team that puts those together. You do capture not just the skill, but the joy, which is a hard thing to do.

SPEAKER_01 37:14

Yeah, I always tell people I'm a bad actor, so uh yeah, you you know you know the videos I don't enjoy doing, uh, if if I did.

SPEAKER_00 37:21

So right. But it's it's that that's what makes them so fun to watch, is because you know, you're laughing as you're doing it, you know, you you just you just really feel it. You and I feel like I'm right there with you, you know, I'm holding my breath.

SPEAKER_01 37:37

Oh well, yeah, that's the best part of like getting kids like sending you videos of them too. And it's like we're all in one community, right? We all love, we all just love hockey, like at the end of the day, right? Even if people don't agree with your approach or this or that or like trick shots, it doesn't matter. We all we all have something in common. Uh, we all love the game.

SPEAKER_00 37:56

Right. Are you impressed by the videos that the kids are sending you?

SPEAKER_01 38:00

Oh god, yeah. And I I tell them all the time, like, they don't believe me, but it's like I'm like, I'm like, dude, eight-year-old you would crush eight-year-old me. Uh, and it would be really close. I'd be crying. Like the the skills they have, especially with the skating, but even even the stick handling is light years ahead of what I do. So I I try to tell kids that to not like inflate their egos too much, but to be like, hey man, the ceiling's really high for you. I know you're looking at current me now, 35 years old, uh, and you're like, oh, you can do so much with a puck, you can be consistent doing these skills. It's like, man, like your your ceiling's quite a bit higher than mine. You're you're young, you don't understand that, but like, you know, keep keep working at your skills. It's it's very slow. Uh, there's many, many years to go and whatever, but you keep loving it and you keep putting in the work uh and focus that's required. I mean, you'll get so much and we see it. We see it in the NHL, like these kids who come into the the league, now they're age 19 tearing it up. It used to take till age 23, 24 to hit your hit your stride a bit. Uh now, like even defensemen, like defensemen used to take really long to develop. Then they're walking in the league, second, third year, top tier. Uh same with these Bedard Celebrini. I mean, it's just it's ridiculous, but it's also I I completely understand it because I I just see their approach to development at that young age compared to like my age bracket. They're doing like way more than us. Uh they have way more uh opportunities to learn on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, whatever tutorials. They understand the moves. There's a lot of good uh channels other than mine that teach application of moves too, which I'm really uh really happy about because I think that's the the unsexy version of hockey that's just like not talked about enough. It's like, well, let's talk about where the moves applied here. Uh and I think uh that's so good uh for kids to see that.

SPEAKER_03 39:56

Well, that that's also the gold, Pavel. You know, again, we'll talk to the kids in a minute on our other show, but that like that's the gold is it kids. If you can search out that application stuff and get make that you know exciting for yourself, man, is that gonna have an impact on your game. And I gotta say this too, buddy. You know, I watch these kids mohawk, I watch these kids do these moves on the ice. I'll I'll be fully transparent with everybody. The first time I pulled off of Michigan, just on practice ice, I was 40 years old. And you know what's funny about it? I did it and I felt like a kid. I really was just like, oh my god, I did that. Uh I won't tell you how old I am now, but the point, the point I'm making is that you know, you but the kids, the kids do this at elementary age. Kids, you are inspiring me when you do it. Yeah, right? Like, I'm I'm not one of these people that's gonna like don't ever miss you get out there. No, there's a the fact you can do it at eight, nine, ten. I mean, uh you said the ceiling. We don't even know the ceiling on where this game's gonna go. Yeah, uh so kids, you gotta keep evolving, right? You gotta keep flowing, but definitely please, for the love of God, uh learn the applications as well if you take anything away from this. But um Pablo, you've been incredibly generous with your time. And I I want to say uh what I said earlier. You're not you're not just teaching skills, uh, you know, you're redefining what skill is, right? And and you're you're inspiring kids to dream. And again, you know, look, you've represented Team Canada, um, and and you are really proof that uh creativity, talk about the sauce, creativity mixed with discipline and passion uh really can coexist. Uh and I think that that that uh sauce, if we're gonna use that word, is the the key. That might be the big takeaway, right? I know we're gonna have a lot of people listen to this episode. Uh and I love so much that this was not a look at all the crazy things Baba Baba does in his video. You know, that's not what this was. That was it was look at how he fails and learns. Look at how he he breaks down skills, look at what he thinks is important in this game for the kids and the coaches and the parents. That's incredible value for our audience. And I want to thank you so much for it.

SPEAKER_00 42:08

Watch how he pushes the envelope all the time. It's so exciting.

SPEAKER_01 42:13

Yeah, no, I appreciate it. Yeah, no, I I think like last thing I'd say to kids is like, you understand social media is everyone's highlight reels and uh all that stuff. So, like you guys talked about earlier, like you don't see the failures away from it. So don't compare yourself to their highlight reels. Like everyone's failing behind the scenes, everyone's struggling behind the scenes. We all go through the same, you know, failures at different rates and stuff like that. So just uh, you know, truly the only one you can compare yourself is is yourself, your former self. As long as you do that, you're on a good pathway to reach your potential. But the moment you start comparing yourself to other people, that's when things start to go downhill. Uh, so yeah, try to pay special attention to that and just compare yourself to your former self. Try to be a little bit better, and I promise you'll get better faster that way.

SPEAKER_03 43:03

That's beautiful, Pavel. Well, look, I you've been very generous with your time, man. I want to thank you so much for coming on. That that's gonna do it for this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey, which will be shared with everybody. Uh, for Pavel Barber for Chris Cash, Shannon Burns for Mike Vanilla, I'm Leah Lias. Remember, if you have any questions for us, email us team at our kidsplayhockey.com or use the link accompanying this episode in the show description. Click it, let us know your name, where you're from. Uh, send us any questions, any thoughts you have. We love hearing from you. Anyway, you guys enjoy your hockey, enjoy your day, work hard, have fun, get better every time. We'll see you next time on our kids play hockey. We hope you enjoyed this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. Make sure to like and subscribe right now if you found value wherever you're listening, whether it's a podcast network, a social media network, or our website, our kidsplayhockey.com. Also, make sure to check out our children's book, When Hockey Stops, at When Hockey Stops.com. It's a book that helps children deal with adversity in the game and in life. We're very proud of it. But thanks so much for listening to this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey, and we'll see you on the next episode.