Pre-Skates & ID Skates Explained: What Parents NEED to Know Before Tryouts

 Hello, hockey friends and families around the world, and welcome back to another edition of

our kids tryout for hockey. Actually, it's our kids play hockey. Funny episode today.

This is our pre -skate, skate ID skate pre -try -out episode so we're not doing the

tryout episode yet that's coming because we know that's one of your favorite episodes

when we talk about evils and tryouts how to approach them the ins the outs the

coaches perspective the parents perspective this is too much of a teaser than it

needed today uh but what we're going to be talking about today is pre -skates and

ID skates okay so I'm here with Mike the two coaches today Christie Casciano-Burns

on assignment I do love saying that um and what we're going to be talking about is

you've probably seen these emails coming out that your organization is going.

but we want to be very clear about what they are. So, Mike, as the elder coach

here, I don't mean an age, I mean an experience. I want you to set this up for

the audience. Pre -skates, the ID skates, they're out, the schedule's out, parents

listening, kids listening are wondering, do I need to do this? The coach is

listening or going, oh, my God, what are they about to say? Mike Bonelli, ladies

and gentlemen.

Yeah, so I'll push back a little bit that I don't like them. I don't like them

when they're used against me if I'm running the organization, but I do like them if

I'm the organization doing them. So I think it's more, I think overall,

like, and again, not getting into tryouts. I think we've had multiple episodes that

tryouts really don't exist anymore. Like I think the, if you're a parent here the

first time, your, your child's coming from like a learn to skate or learn the play

or a wreck environment, yes, there are you are in a tryout like you go to a rink

they're opening up it's your first year of squirt hockey say it's like you're you're

nine years old or 10 years old you're you're trying out for a 10 you team you

could go in there and you could turn some heads and be like oh where that could

come from like i've never seen that player so i think that's where when you when

we go back to the id skates which frankly have started in 2025,

if you listen to the episode in 2026 right now, like, I saw ID skates over the,

over the holiday break, and saw, you know, ID skates right before New Year's.

Yeah. And now we're starting to see the next wave of ID skates, evaluations, and

opportunities to see their players. So if you're in the organization running it,

I would say, good for you.

You're circumventing the way the rule is written, and if I was the person fighting

it, I would say, well, then go back to your governing body and say, well, then why

don't you have a rule that you can enforce? Because it's just not a real, it's

just not a tryouts, again, in my opinion, or a thing in the past, they don't exist

anymore, especially at the older levels, anything above 10 years old, ID skates, and

evaluations have now become the chance to showcase your child's skills and, you know,

get a look at a player

before the rest of the group does. But I would even go even further to that and

say most ID skates don't even involve skating. They just involve you signing up your

child with money because somebody's already told you that you're on the team. So as

you look through through the lens of what the ID skate has become, it's really just

another portal to bring kids in earlier than everyone else within the rules of USA

hockey. Well, and without tampering, right? So one of the big things that I'm told

about all the time is, you know, tampering. We can't tamper, which is true, right?

At least it should be true. Whereas, like, you're not allowed to really actively

recruit players from another team in terms of on ice.

During the game, during the game. Like, do you have, do you have an evaluation link

you can send me? And I'm like, we're in the game right now. We're playing in the

game. So it's crazy. I'm going to take a step back. Maybe we'll go over the place

here. There's a great explanation of what these are, Mike. All right. And the buyer

beware tag is on these things of, there's a lot of different ways you can look at

it from a negative standpoint. It could be a cash grab in your mind. It could be

an unfair advantage for some teams in your mind you know i do want to share my at

least my coaching perspective on this now every coach is different mike i think you

and i'll be somewhat aligned on this but i'm very content follow me here everybody

coaching the kids that are in front of me okay like whoever i pick i'm going to

coach those kids all right and this is at any age level it's it might not even be

kids right it's whatever players are on the team is who I'm going to coach, all

right? It's my job to coach them up. Now, with that said, I'm not saying that I'm

not going to try and put the best team on the ice, all right? Like, I do actively

look at the players, look at their families, look at who they are. But to say what

Mike's point was earlier in parents listening, this is the most important thing if

you take anything away from these kind of e -val pre -skate episodes, It is a year

-long exploration into who you are as a family, into who your kid is as a player,

how coachable they are. By the Eval, I mean, most of the time I know already. And

again, look, we said this in the last episode. The truth is this, 85 to 90 % of

the team. It's not that they're picked. It's they're projected, right? Mike, like

they're projected to make the team. We have an idea of who's going to be on the

team. So if we're doing anything at eval it's usually coming down to a few bubble

players right and we know their ability usually too I mean there is the occasional

wild card that comes out of nowhere all right but but we put too much emphasis I

got to say this too Mike depending on the age group again we'll do our normal

split like beneath 12 and above 12 if you're if you're under 12 you if you're 12

you are under excuse me the fact that we're talking about ID and,

you know, tampering and looking, I mean, it's ridiculous to me. It's unbelievable to

me that in youth sports, we do this. Now, I know there are people listening, well,

I got to switch teams and I got to do this. I'm not saying that's wrong all the

time, but I'm saying, man, do we put more pressure on this than we need to, right?

Your kid's got a place somewhere. As long as your kids, if you've got a good coach

and your kids having fun under 12 it's true over 12 too but under 12 you're a

good spot you're in a good spot make sure you're a kid is telling you whether

they're happy or not though so many parents oh Mike we're not happy here you're not

happy or the kids are you're both not happy are you sure the kid's not happy is

kids smiling out there right go ahead Mike yeah I just think it's like it's like I

think parents feel like they're the sucker if they wait go to tryouts. I really do.

I think they think like I and because like even me now like what you get I'm

getting calls like I'm negotiating with parents of like 2017s.

Like that's a that's a very young child like a little baby. Yeah they're turning

out. Well like like like like you know I'm hearing from program directors around the

country really but like everybody like the guy the guys and girls I talk to that

are in this every day. Um and running ID skates. You know, and running ID skates.

I'm not going to say that the programs that even that I'm associated with and work

with and advise and run around with don't run them because it becomes a self

-fulfilling prophecy. Like you have to run in because the other guy's running it. And

if you don't run something, you can't capture at least the information on the

player. But I am convinced that nobody, If you're going to do anything that involves

travel hockey and any label that's from A, AA, or elite,

or AAA, you're not going to a rink. And the first time somebody knows about you is

when you step on the ice. Right. It's just very, it's just not really accurate

anymore. Because even now, parents are now have to be proactive. It's like, Hey, my

son's coming to tryouts. He's coming from this organization. Here's his hockey resume.

Here's what he's done in the past. We've heard really great things about you. We'd

love to play for you. What can you do for us? And oh, by the way, my son's six.

And that happens all the time. It's not even, like, it sounds crazy. And then we

accept the call. Like, we actually take, like Me? I'll take that call. I'll take

that email. I will too. Yeah. I'm like, okay. I said, yeah, I'd love to have them.

Where are you coming from? Oh, you have to take how many ferries to get here?

Yeah, no problem. I think it's a great choice. Like so to me, going back to what

you said earlier, if you're a coach right now of a AAA elite team, say they're 12

years old, 13 years old, 14 years old, lock them up, get Get them in. I think USA

hockey should allow. I mean, I probably have to brush up on the rules a little

bit. But those players that are on your team today, you should be able to lock

them in right now for next year. They should have to go to another tryout. If I

believe in you and you believe in me, sign up, we're in. Yeah. And if you choose

to go explore to see the grass greener on the other side, then you've forfeited

your right to be, you know, guaranteed a spot. I think it would eliminate,

I think if you allowed those players to sign up for the team they're already on

and lock them in, it's, listen, it's the appeal of college coaches and a lot of

high school coaches that they get to work with a player for like two or three or

four years. It's so appealing to do that, right? If you're working with a youth

program and you're working with, like if you're a real coach and you really want to

make an impact, working with a kid for six months does not do that. No. Working

with a kid for three years, six years? Six years. Oh, my God, it's like the best.

So, you know, if you're a coach out there, you know, you should find a way to

lock those kids in. I'm going to explore that with you a little bit more here,

Mike, because there's a whole other side of this, right? Like, again, we told the

audience, like we're talking a little bit about the darker side of this right now,

you know, there is a light side too. But the other side of this is, and I'm going

to speak from my own experience. I'm like, I know you do this too. Build a program

and a team where the culture is so strong and the development is so strong that

nobody wants to go anywhere else. They want to be with you. Right. And I'm I

actually, I rarely talk about like my own process in terms of like like the

successes of it but that has been very successful for me i i want to create an

environment where kids or when i coach national team adults want to be there and

what's crazy about it mike and this is a cool stat that i'm very proud of with uh

those you know i coach the puerto rican women's national team okay and every time i

say that people go there's hockey in puerto rico yes we have a very good team,

right? Mostly NCAA players. All right. We have gone, from my start, we had 15

players to over 100 in one year. All right. And it's not,

I'm not saying that's because of me. I'm saying that we as a whole created an

environment and a culture that is so strong that people are now wanting to play for

us. All right? And again, And, you know, the naysayers out there said, well, yeah,

you have to qualify that for being Puerto Rican. While we have a strong team,

that's not the largest pool of players in the world, right? We grew awareness. Yeah,

we grew awareness. We grew culture. We shared that mission. And now they are finding

us. This applies to youth organizations, right? I want people to say,

man, Lee's a great coach. You'll love playing for that guy. People want to be

underneath Lee as a player, not underneath. But you know what I'm saying? They want

to play for that guy because he creates great culture and it's great development. I

don't want it to be, well, Lee wins all the time. That's why you want to play for

him. That team wins, and that's why you want to play for him. And I'll say too,

Mike, again, please cut me off here in a minute. But I'm very blessed that a lot

of the teams I work with do win, but it's not because we're focused so much on

the winning. We're focused on the culture. We're focused on the development. We're

focused on making better hockey players. So for the parents listening, that's what

you should be looking for. And here's the problem that you're going to go back and

forth here. Everyone's selling that this time of year. Everyone's selling how great

their culture is, a tryout time. How wonderful is a tryout time. You know, do your

research. Talk to the people on the team. Talk about how great it is. Look, Mike,

to your point earlier two, I want to say this. I'm not going to turn down a call

from a player or a family. I mean, I'll take every call, all right, because I do

want to build a great team, all right, but not at the sacrifice of our culture or

of our morals, right? That's what you should be looking for and trying to get into.

And here's the nice part about it is if you're that type of family where the

culture matches, it becomes a pretty quick match. If you're just trying to find a

winner, it's so obvious to me very quickly what your intentions are, right?

If you're shopping around or you're not giving me like easy information,

like how to contact someone, I know you're shopping around. And I'm probably not

going to pursue you at that point. You can pursue me, but it's like, I'm not going

to be left out in the cold when you decide someone else is better for your family.

All And if they are great, like, I'm not, I'm upset. Like, if you find a thing

that fits me, I want your kid to be where they want to be. All right, right? It's

my job to create the environment for them to want to be with us. Is it all that

fair, Mike, what I just said? That's got to be, yeah, I mean, it says, well, the

problem is when I look at it's like common sense. Like, there has to be a core

belief that, but a core value that I have that I want, I only want players that

want to play for me. Right, right. Like, I'm not, I'm not negotiating with you. I

think the world of NIL and all this sort of stuff. And we see it right now, how

it's beating up college coaches. Like it's literally destroying the college game and

what it's meant to be. Because really good coaches that want to coach are now

becoming agents. Yeah. It's what's pro sports. And they're really like letting their

values win. I mean, you know, lose, it to really what they want. And I think if

you're out there as a parent right now and you have a player that you're

negotiating with a coach and they're talking about how close a family they are and

what kind of development structure they have and how great they are and they're

undercutting five or six kids on their current team right now to try to get you,

then that is not the coach that is following those values or adhering to those

things. I've been the player on those teams where the coach is willing to cut you

for that and um it's look it's a touchy subject right because um at the older

levels they're going to build the most talented team and i can understand that i

think the questions are is there a place for me to go to develop right um and

i'll also say this too that i have seen coaches sell their soul for players i

wrote about this in my book and it destroys the I've seen, I've seen coaches get

the most talented players they can find, but they're not great people and that the

culture is destroyed and the team does not succeed. Yeah, no, I've, I've copied

literal chapters of your book and sent them the coaches that I said, how do you

have 50 % turnover on your team? Like, how, I mean, and I'm talking about the real

teams that want to win, like teams that want to win and they're, and they think it

by plugging the holes of just bringing in another player. And everybody else in the

team sees that. Like every single kid in the locker room goes, who's this kid? And

who are these three kids? And, oh, wait, is he coming in from my position? Or, you

know, what, like, it just, what happens in undercuts everything you chose,

if you did it, chose to do as far as building a culture in your team by always

undercutting your players looking for the next best player instead of developing the

talent that you picked in the first place. And let me tell you something, that

catches up with coaches really quick. And when you see coaches out at the bottom of

the barrel all the time, and maybe they have that one year. And the next thing you

know, it just drops because they chose to go away from their culture, go away from

their real beliefs, go away from what they're probably really good at and that's

coaching and become negotiators and looking for the next like flash of the pan and

then now you're and you're taking players that really need to fight for you at the

end and you and you're diminishing their opportunity i got a statement here mike

this might be the core of the episode here this is why i love talking with you

mike because you and christie always make me think live on the air um parents

listen to this one there is a big difference between a hockey coach and a salesman.

And there are a lot of coaches that are salesmen, all right? Good ones. Good

salesman, yeah. And they will convince you that this is the right place for you,

but that's what they're good at. The actual hockey stuff is very average. I don't

want to downplay them too much. All right. But you'll know great coaches by one in

my opinion like one really important factor which is you can feel that they care

about your kid you can feel it right on the ice off the ice they're going to do

everything they can to help your kid all right uh but i i have been sold by

salesmen to come to their team again a bit more wiser to it now there are signs

when someone's a salesman you know is a salesman. They're also yesmen. Everything you

dream of will happen on this team. That's not realistic.

Let's just talk about how to identify a salesman, right? That's one of them. If

they're just yesing you to death, that's a red flag. I'll make a captain. I'll make

assistant captain. I'll put you on the first line. You'll start in net major red

flags. You got to be careful with that, right? No,

No great coach is going to promise anyone a line without knowing that's going to

change, right? Because I'll tell you right now, if your game goes to hell, you're

not going to be on the top line anymore. That's just how it is. Go ahead, Mike. I

know I quote Nick Saban a lot, but there was a really great story in his book. I

forget the player and he was recruiting, but it was the top recruit in the country

for quarterback. And the kid said and the had said, like, we went to Alabama

because Coach Saban was the only one that didn't guarantee him a starting spot as a

freshman. And guess what? It made him the greatest, like made him one of the

greatest quarterbacks in college football. And then, and then Saban quits, I should

say, Saban retires, you know, quit. He retires because NIL won't allow for that

anymore, basically. That's why he said it. He said, I can't, I can't coach. Yeah,

I'm not a coach anymore. I'm not a coach anymore. Like, You become not a coach.

You become a manager and an agent. And I think, you know, for me, like, going back

to, like, the whole ID skate and the whole, like, getting looked at early and

earlier and earlier and earlier. Like, again, you got to remember, we're hiding

tryouts in winter because saying that we're going to do a special winter select team

or we're going to do, like, a tournament team. And so, I don't know, I wish they

would just throw out all the, all these regulations personally because they're not

getting abided by anyway. And I just wish they'd say, if you want to go to a team

and you sign up, then you sign up whenever you want. If you want to do it in

January, you want to do it in November, just go sign up for the team. Now you are

talking NIL. And then build and then build player, well, whatever. But then then

make forced teams, force coaches, force organizations to build teams that people want

to go to. Yeah, I agree with you. And it's just, it's just to me, or you have to

go the other way. If you live in this place, you can only play in these places.

That's it. But we're not built like that. Like, we're not built, especially on the

East Coast. We're not, we have, like, where I'm from, there's 17 rinks within a

half hour of each other. Me too. So, like we're not built for well if you live on

this block you must play for this team right right we're not built like that so

the only other way to do it is to either a discipline the programs that are

blatantly recruiting and signing kids early or let them do it and say hey just let

let let the let's stop acting like it's not happening like let's not and we all

look at each other because what problem is then it's just like having a like a

like a a student that misbehaves and everybody's misbehaving and then the one day

you're going to come down on that one student yeah and they're like well all those

students did it all year well that's the rule I go yeah but it hasn't been the

rule all year why is it now the rule today yeah and I think that happens all the

time in USA hockey and in governing bodies Because all of a sudden, they want to

put the hammer down. Like, well, where was that hammer for the last six months?

Right. And it's just like, you know, if I get pulled over because my windows are

too tinted, then the cop says, oh, I'm pulling over. When does it's the tinted? I

go, there's 17 cars right in front of me. I know, but I stopped you. But you're

the one I stopped. That's so I think it's just like. One time I got stopped

because the cop said, well, you had a different license plate. He said that to me.

You just had a different state. I was like, wow, if you're from, yeah, if you're

from Pennsylvania, I'm pulling you over too. But I think it's just like, I think

it's, I think it's one of these things where, you know, the IDScape piece has to

be framed in the fact that it's just, if you're, if the organization's using it to

just see who's interested, then great, you know, whatever, who cares. But if the,

if the kid that's going to it doesn't think that the organization they are currently

in doesn't know about it, you're delusional. Of course. So what do you think is

going to happen? The minute you do that, the minute you go to an ID skate of an

organization in season, the organization you're currently with is like, well, this

person really isn't value being with me. Right. So they're going to do one of two

things, right? They're either going to up to negotiating. And maybe that's your

tactic. Maybe your tactic is say, hey, I'm going to show them that, hey, how great,

how difficult it's going to be without me, or they're going to say, oh, that kid's

kind of a bubble kid anyway. So now it's easier for me to cut him because he

doesn't want to be here anyway. So it's a very, it's a very, you've got to be

really careful about how you frame it and how you use the ID skate. And if you're

a parent that says, and I'll lay one more thing, if you're a board member of the

organization that's making decisions for all the other kids in the organization and

your child goes to another idea, you should be taken off the board immediately.

Like, you should not be allowed to dictate what other people's kids are doing and

restricting what they can and can't do. If your own kid is going to see what's out

there to test the water. If you're going to represent an organization, your kid

needs to be representing that organization. And I got to say this. I could name

seven organizations right now that their board members' kids are at other people's

IDs. Right. And I do want to say this, Mike, because I'm going to get called a

hypocrite if I don't. Like, I'm heavily involved with my local youth team, but my

daughter plays for a different team. But that was because she switched to an all

-girls team. And to me, that was - They don't offer an all -girls team. Right. And

they don't. Right. So that was an acceptable, because I really thought about that.

To me, that was an acceptable change, right? And I want to take this a little bit

with that, too. So, you know, parents listening are going to go, yeah, but Mike,

what am I supposed to do? Other kids are doing it. I don't know what I'm doing.

What if I miss this and there's an opportunity here? This is what you need to do,

okay? Let's start going into some solutions here. If you're feeling the phomo of not

going to ID skates at other organizations, just take a step back. And first off,

ask yourself, why are you?

Why? And then you've got to think about it, not about what the other kids are

doing. What do you want as a family? Look at the teams. Look at the coaches for

the next year and say, are these great coaches? I can tell you that with so much

certainty, my friends listening, that there have been years that I have opted when I

was in youth hockey. And I'm so thankful we made these decisions. I opted to play

for teams with great coaching that I knew would not be the top teams in the

district or whatever we did back then. And I learned so much those years. I became

such a better hockey player those years than when I was just on a winning team.

And I love winning. I love when my teams would win, but I'd be lying if I told

you the teams that won and everyone should experience winning. Don't get me wrong.

I'm not downplaying that. I'm just saying I always learned more in the other years

than I did the years when we won. When we were winning, it was because what I had

learned was paying off. And you've got to have those years. But you've also got to

have the, I call them the development years, there's confidence years and development

years. And if you've got a great coach that's teaching your kid to be great or

better, I would not stray from that. I wouldn't. So you've got to sit down and

write down. What are your goals? What do you want to accomplish? Now, the other

thing that comes up a lot, I was going to say a note earlier that, yeah our

if you're trying to go from tier two to tier one. There's a lot of people go,

well, I want to do that. So this is what I always tell parents and the kids, that

if you are a tier two player and you're interested in going to tier one,

these skates, you have to go in it with the right mindset of, yeah, go, go do it.

I don't have a problem with that if you're trying to go to a higher level. I want

you to succeed at the highest level you can succeed at but you got to go in with

the right mindset which is you may or may not make this team the more important

mindset is why don't you see where you're at because to make a tier one team

sometimes it could take a year or two or three right before you're able to play at

that level but you won't know where you're at until you skate with some of these

kids so you know i had a kid last night say to me hey i'm gonna i think i want

to go try out for this tier one team he plays tier two i said yeah go this is

my organization go go do it see where you can do because if you can make that

team and your family can commit to that to that travel and that money i don't want

to hold you back i really don't i really don't i hate to lose you but go see

where you rank and then you know what come back to me with a plan if you don't

make the team of the things you need to work on be proactive instead of coming

back and saying oh that's stupid they didn't pick me no how did you feel out there

did you feel like you matched out there. Did you feel like you were there? I'm

going to turn a little bit here, Mike, and I'm throwing it to you. Like, if you're

going to go to an ID skate or a pre -skate, there's a few different ways you

should be doing that, right? One, if it's within your own organization, I really

hope you look at it like, well, it's just, it's good ice time to get ready for e

-vals. Like, the way I look at it is if my kids off for two or three weeks prior

to tryouts, the pre -skates are great because it gets you on the ice, Right. You

get to move around a little bit. That's a, that's a tremendous value if you haven't

skated or two or three weeks. All right. Now, if you're just finishing the season

and it's happening during the season, I wouldn't do them. No, like you're in season.

All right. But if you just need a skate warm up or chance to move around, they're

great. If you are seriously considering changing organizations, there's value there.

You get to meet some of the kids. You get to meet some of the coaches for the

first time. It is a out for you. I mean, they get to see you. All right. Like,

there are reasons these things are okay. All right. But if it's based on FOMO,

based on, you're shopping yourself to five different evals, that's,

that's tough for me as a coach. That's tough for me as a coach because it means

you don't know what you want. Right. I want you to know what you want. What do

you want? You want great coaching? Do you want to win? I'm going to say this too.

There's nothing wrong with any of these answers. If you're saying, well, I want to

play for a winning team, I get it. I can understand that. I'm not telling you that

your reasons are wrong, but have a freaking reason. Don't go to four pre -skates and

then say, well, I like their jersey the best. I want that gear. Go ahead, Mike.

That's okay, too, I guess. I mean, if you like it, if you like it, if you like

it, I mean, it's your favorite team. I do know people that weigh that, yeah. I

think, but the other side, too, and you said it a little earlier too is be careful

if you go to an evaluation or an ID skate and you're and you're and you're like

oh this guy's on the team like he's going to make the team no problem like if you

came out of nowhere like you have to have a little bit of like you better look

around like well how how can how am I making this team like how are there seven

spots available on this right and And be careful the fact that you've developed to

a point where maybe if you can hold your own on the ice with the team you're on,

you better be so much better than every single person on the team you're currently

on to switch to a team that you think might be better for your development. And

it's just they have a roster spot because seven kids left. That's a whole different

scenario. And again, I know if you're a new parent to this whole thing, it's hard.

It's not easy. And if you're a seasoned veteran parent, it's like, oh, yeah,

I've been in that row before. Like, I've been, like, I, like, I, I, I remember

there was an organization that I was working with and, and six of them left one

team to try out in an out, in an e -val ID skate. And all six made the, the,

quote, unquote, triple A higher level team. I'm like, all six of you made the other

team. I said, how was there even that much room in the roster like for you to

make the team and like oh we tore it up I go yeah but your current team could

beat that team so why like why are you leaving is it because of the letters is it

because of the more travel is it because of the exposure like again it's it's you

have it's buyer beware just understand if if six kids from your organization go and

try out in another organization that's better and they all make it I I probably go

well how the hell there.

to play with. There's no doubt that if you're in the organization, it's going to

give you a leg up to find out where you want to be. I mean, like, it's just like

you get to see the body of work. Like this whole thing with like, you know,

telling me you can see a kid in an hour. Yes, of course we can see he's good.

He's talented. Yes. But I can tell anything about the kid other than that. We can

get a base level of evaluation, meaning I can see their skill sets.

That's basically it. Right. And trust me, there's be no lack of parents in the

same.

It's a it's a it's a it's a it's a organizations vary in who they are. There's

loyal organizations and I don't mean loyal meaning like I mean loyal at that their

first priority is to develop the kids they currently have. Right. And then there's

just, you know, compilers like like like throw, throw 150 kids on the ice and I'm

going to grab the top 50 no matter who they are no matter who they're, you know,

no matter of anything, I'm picking them based off of that. That kid goes around a

cone better than that kid and I'm picking the kid I'm compiling the best kids

there's nothing wrong with that either just understand the program you're going to

the id skit for coach the kids in front of you all right i'm going to say this

too mike that that you're just making me think about so i i just want to talk to

the parents again um what i'm about to say is easier said than done relax just

relax like i i i mean it like we put more stress on our kids than we need to

and like if your kid is freaking out about tryouts there's a good chance you're

freaking out about tryouts all right and it's just relax like i i got to say this

too it's like we always talk about the ROI and the value right like there's this

is going to sound so bad but there's so much value in life experience and not

making the team you want to make, right? I know that's a weird statement. Of course

you want your kids to make the team they want to make. But the truth is this. And

parents, correct me if you disagree with what I'm about to say. The truth is this,

a lot of the anxiety, most of the anxiety, is coming from you don't want your kid

to feel the immense pain they're going to feel when they don't make the team they

want to make. I'm a parent, and I understand that feeling. But I am also,

and I mean this parents, I'm very content with it. If my kid doesn't make the team

they want, that there's an opportunity there for me as the dad and my wife as the

mom to teach them about accountability. There's also a little self reflection of if

your kid didn't make the team they wanted to make, there's probably a reason for

that. And the reason is not always the coach screwed me. The reason is your kid

might be being put at an appropriate development level for their abilities. And that

you have to be okay with that. I'm going to say this statement. And I want

everyone to hear me. There's nothing wrong with being on a B team. There's nothing

wrong all right i always know there's a few players on the beat team to think they

should be on a team and maybe you should all right but but like you have to deal

with the hand you were given and you've got to be able to be comfortable with

growing in that environment and if you are blaming the organization blaming the coach

and blaming the other parents and blame the other team your kid is going to end up

doing that in their life they're going to blame everybody else and and i'm going to

say this too You may have a point. You may have a point with some of that. Don't

tell your kid that. Kids got to be accountable. Now is your opportunity to lead

this team. Now is your opportunity to learn. Let's meet the coach. All right?

Typically, I know it's like B team coaches, typically volunteers. Typically pretty

good coaches, right? Nobody volunteers and like, I want to coach B. Like the people

coach and B are making a choice to be there. They probably really care. Okay, so

again. They probably do. They probably do. And they want to try to be a new.

team that says, oh, you know, I'm going to try to pick a team that's going to

give us the least chance of winning. They don't do that. No. So if you're, like,

I've always looked at it. Like, I've been, I've been blessed with having been a

part of a lot of really great organizations, high level, low level, B level, A

level, pro level. And parents, during the tryout process, literally, I could get

anything. They love me. Tickets. tickets,

coffee, every practice, I've got another cup of coffee sent to me, right? If you

trust me enough that you want your son to play for me and then I cut them and

then you tell me I'm full of, you know, you know what? Then then I just don't

take any value in that. I'm like, well, you loved me three for the last three

weeks. You thought I was the greatest thing ever. And if I'm so good at what I do

and I think I then I'm good I'm it's painful like nobody wants to listen nobody

enjoys the process of cutting a child oh it's nobody enjoys the process of having

to make a decision yeah on a bubble kid nobody but don't make it easy for us like

don't make it easy for the coach to do that you can make it easy trust me but

nobody likes it nobody revels in it no i i to this day i'll wake up in the

middle of the night saying i can't believe like i didn't give that other kid a

chance or wow i really let's take a i'll take it a step further for you how about

this parents there are kids that are massive trouble making kids that you might go

god i hope he doesn't pick that kid it it still hurts cutting that kid even though

even though it's like everything you says oh says, oh, we've got to cut that kid.

I've never cut anyone and taken any enjoyment ever, ever. I can't think of one time

where I felt that. And I'll tell you right now, if coach is listening, if you take

enjoyment in that, oh, man, you need to do some self -reflection. I've been relieved

that a kid has pretty much cut themselves, like done things. Yeah, that's different.

I've been relieved, like, oh, I dodged the bullet there. Like, this kid made it so

easy for me to get rid of that I didn't have to do that. But to me, that's

different. That's different. Nobody wants to look at a kid that's working his ass

off and showing up to all the dry lands and doing all the workouts and watching

his nutrition and working on all the things you ask a player to do. And then you

have to cut them, nobody, nobody wants to do that. I'll say this too, to the point

we were making earlier too, for anybody that's obsessed or focused on, quote,

unquote, making it to the next level, making it it's a high -level hockey. It's the

kids who go through a lot of adversity that tend to make it. There's so many

studies. We'll have to do an episode on this coming out right now that early

talent does not make it. Like by and large, they don't make it. It's the kids who

face a lot of adversity and drive through it and push through it. They're finding

those are the kids now that are making it to the point that even the U .S.

national team, the development teams, like the U you 16 you they're not identifying

early early talent anymore they're waiting to see what kids break through of that

time period and faced adversity because they're finding those kids are tougher this

has been a big discussion in hockey Canada as well I don't want to get away from

ID skates and pre skates again that'll be a different episode but look we're

bringing up a lot of these these tryout ID skate topics and these emotions because

it's important to identify them before you go in right I like Mike, I say it every

year, without fail, last six years, someone comes up to me at the e -val because

I'm typically actually in the stands, all right? This year I'll be doing more of

the eval process, but a parent will say, how are you so calm? How are you so

calm? And I, because I have no control over what's going to happen here. It's done.

Like, it's already, first of them, it's already done, right? And I just want my kid

to go out there. And I've been asked this, what do you tell your kid before the e

-vail? When they're younger, when they were young, hey, you're going to a skate

today. I don't even tell them it's an e -val. I don't even say, yeah, you better

do good today because, no, I want them to play their game. I tell them, you got

to go hard, you got to work hard. Like, don't go out there and be a schmock,

okay? Like, I might give them that, like, make sure you're working hard today. But

I don't put too much emphasis on it. And here's the funny thing, parents, by the

time the kids recognize and realize they're going to the tryout, they will put

enough pressure on themselves. okay and if they're not putting enough pressure on

themselves you can give a little tap maybe but let it be that they're not mature

enough yet to understand you putting more pressure on them to succeed is not going

to help them succeed in today's environment 30 40 years ago that might have been a

different conversation all right but like like if your kid's nervous man you should

be the safe place for them just go out there and do your best. And if you're

going to an ID skate or a pre -skate and you're putting pressure on them for that,

oh, man, I don't know what to say this one, Mike. It's like, you should not be

doing that at a pre -skate or an ID skate. You should have very clear goals and

thoughts of why you're doing this. We're going to this so you can meet the coaches,

you can see the other players, and you can work and see how you feel. That's a

safe environment. If you say to your kid, you need to perform here so they're going

to take you at tryouts i mean parents what are we doing what what are we doing to

our kids in that environment all right you're going to scare them to death and i

will say if the id skate is free and it's not interfering with your normal skate

go to it yeah that's nothing wrong with that yeah you know what until the coach

hey listen i'm going to this free skate the guys like i would say free or like

very low cost let's let's throw that in yeah but you know And frankly, like, you

know, even the ID skate, like, what is it? Like, what is it worth to you? Like,

is it really worth you giving up a spot on your current team? Like, because

remember, once you start shopping, then the shopping goes both ways.

It just does. So once you start shopping around and everyone knows that this is not

the world of, I can't, you know, listen, when I grew up, I had no idea that kids

on other teams. I was like, what do you mean there's another team in the other

town. I didn't even know we had another team. there's another team. Like, nobody

knows. Like, nobody knew. Now everyone knows. You do your, you know, your kid does

an Instagram post that he's walking in the locker in another team and everyone knows

it the next day, right? So, I love that. So, so somebody's doing a live stream of

the, of the, of the E Valley and the, you know, it's just, listen, it's just, we

all want kids to play for us. I get it. We all want to be the first choice, but

the minute you choose not to have the first choice be the team you're on now, and

you start shopping, then everyone's shopping. So just be aware of that. I want to

say this, Mike, and you can comment on this too. Kids move teams.

It's not a note. We're having a whole episode about it.

Coaches

when you do this a lot all right we know when you've been on three different teams

and we know when you're shopping around i'm not saying don't come to me if that's

the case i'm saying that you we noted right like we noticed that oh that kids

played on three different teams and three different years there could be a lot of

reasons for that so i'm not going to say there's a broad like outcome of us

knowing that but just know that we know that we see you shopping. We see when

you're not giving this information. If I can't trust the family, that's not going to

bode well, okay? I'm not saying that you're not going to make the team. It's not

fair to say that. Again, every situation is a little different. But if I can tell

you're shopping, I'm not going to spend too much time recruiting, if any time.

Recruiting is not even the right word, especially at the younger ages. There's no

way. Now, when you get older, yeah, there's some recruiting, Okay, but that's a

different type of hockey. You know, I want to kind of end here, too, Mike, on some

stories here. There's a family I know I'm very close with right now that their son

is playing in a very high youth level. All right. So like really kind of pre

-college at this point and being called up, being called down,

right, moving all around. And when you look at it from a lens of just kind of

watching it, you can see how this might be really stressful for this family. And

they are doing this so correctly because they're so calm about it. And when I talk

to the parents, it's we've raised our boy well. He's driving himself to these

situations. He'll find his path and he's doing the best he can. If that's how

they're doing it at the highest level, And this is the highest level. This kid is

playing at the highest level he can right now for his age. Why would we not do

that at the younger levels? And the thing is, I know this family. They've been this

way with their kid from the start, from Adams. And that kid is succeeding because

the day -to -day ocean wave of, okay, you're up, you're down,

you're left, you're right, colleges are looking. there's recruiters at this game. It's

not, at least not on the surface, phasing this kid. Because he understands that is

the process. And it is a joy to talk to his parents about it. And don't get me

wrong, do they have parental anxiety about it? A bit,

yeah. It's like their young boy is becoming, you know, going to college or looking

at junior. Of course, but they have so much grace with it that it's like, You feel

with them. Like, oh, man, I'm really wishing you the best. This is a top level

player. It shouldn't be limited top level players that are doing this. All right?

That's the first story. The second story, which I've told before, is I've had

parents come up to me and say to me, convince me to stay.

My answer to you is no. That is not my job to convince you to stay. All right.

If you are not confident in what we are doing as a team, do what you're going to

do. I mean, my convincing you to stay was my body of work over the eight -month

season. If that did not convince you, which is fine. Like I said, I'm not judging

you on it. Then you do what you got to do. But when you come to me to say,

convince me to stay, I had a parent do that one time. I said, well, why are you

thinking about leaving? And you know what, Mike didn't get a great answer. I didn't

get a great answer. It's just you think the grass is greener. All right. And to

all the parents listening, all the players listening, you have to do what you think

is best for your family. All right. You do. And again, every situation is very

different. But whether it's an ID skate, a pre -skate, an e -val, What we are asking

you to do is sit down, maybe do some goal setting. What is it that you want out

of youth hockey? Why do you want to stay or want to go? Why are you looking at

15 different ID skates? And be very honest with your answers. Is it because the

other kids are doing it? Is it because there's a prestigiousness with an order of

the organization perceived prestigiousness? Is it because you don't like where you're

at right now, which is an absolutely acceptable answer? Like There are absolutely

reasons to switch teams. We've said that since day one of this show. But be honest

with yourself. And for the love of the hockey gods, do not put pre -skates and ID

skates as the be -all end -all of your season. Go listen to last year's Eval tryout

episode. It's the whole year, right? They're great if you want to get to know the

coaches. They're great if you want to get to see the other kids. They're great if

you want to see where you might rank within another team in an organization. And

they're great to get on the ice just to get moving around. They are not great if

you think they are going to be what selects your kid. They are not great if they

are a cash grab. They are not great if you're doing 10 of them. And they are not

great if you are being told yes to death by the organization that your kid's going

to be the greatest person in the organization if you come to my ID skate that's on

that up okay Mike

yeah I mean unless unless you're the kid unless you are that kid I don't know I

mean like if you're good or not listen it's going to I'm not going to I'm not

going to say that it's not a it's not a it's not something great to hear right if

you're a parent of a kid you want to hear oh your your child is probably,

you know, somebody we can make, we can mold, we can turn it. Sure, yeah, but

that's not what I, that's not the same thing as you're going to be first line

center captain. Yeah, but maybe, well, if that, and that's the case, you're getting

told that and you believe it, and that's who your child becomes, and they're going

to build a team around that kid, listen, I think that's great. I just don't think

it. The reality is if you're, uh, any child below the age of 16, You've got to,

you know, write down your pros and cons, figure out what means to leave somewhere

and stay somewhere. But I think all the things like the checklist that you gave is

really more of the norm and above the norm. It's the actual facts,

except for those one percenters. And those one percenters aren't going ID skates.

They're not going. They don't need to. Like those kids aren't, you know, those are

the kids that are being asked to do certain things on teams and again if you're

that child's parents more power to you great make you know help revolve the program

around your kid awesome but for the rest of us think about all the pros and cons

of being in your organization determine whether an ID skate is going to make or

break you know what you want to have for your child. If you need options, great.

Like I said, in other parts of the country that listen to this, you don't even

have those options. Like, it's like, well, even if I hated the program I'm in, what

am I going to do? Travel two and a half hours to go to another program. So you're

getting, like, we're very, we're cursed and blessed on the East Coast to have all

these great options of, if we're unhappy, tomorrow I can go to another team and not

and not affect my the miles on my car but for some of us we don't have those

options right and and i think you know evaluate you know and again i think the

last thing i would say about id skates and when you're making the decisions to go

somewhere you know i would go to an id skate so you get value at it like go to

an id skate that that somebody's running like a clinic where they're they're actually

skating you that's a great point it's not just like you go out there and do sticks

and pucks or something like go out and find some value in the in the skate and

and if you if you really go out there and you know and i would say that if the

id skate is meant to be a showcase of your child you know probably don't go after

two and a half hours of lacrosse practice you know maybe go go fresh and and

understand like you're going there to get a good skate in but don't be stressed

Don't be doing it last minute. Don't be putting all this undue pressure on the

player that they must perform. And then don't put them in a place where you just

did a whole tournament weekend. The ID skates Monday afternoon. The kid is burnt to

crisp. And then you're asking the kid to go on the ice and do something positive.

It's just a bad look. And it's not helping your kid. And it's not helping the

evaluator look at your kid. You're like, I thought this kid was good. He's just got

off a 12 -hour road trip from a tournament this weekend. Just be aware of all that

kind of stuff. But there's so many factors that go into it. I think ultimately, you

know, the ID skate is what it is. It's a way to circumvent the rules of a tryout

and be aware of what it really is and then, you know,

react accordingly. Well, and one more tip for, I guess, organizers, Mike, would be,

and you just mentioned it get a great coach to run these skates and market that

that this coach is going to be running it it's going to we're going to it you can

say it maybe it is a pre -skater or id skate but we're going to be working on

these skills your kid will get value out of this clinic that this great coach is

coming in to run right like i i sometimes i do that like when i'm doing

evaluations i want to first off i want to watch i don't want to be coaching that

right find someone great to come in and really teach the kids something and pay pay

for it right yeah you're paid anyway it's something out of it yeah yeah all right

this has been a very good episode where we've ided the id skate right to quote

lavar burton but you don't have to take our word for it right make sure you let

us know your your thoughts on this this is one of those episodes you can have a

lot of thoughts email us team at our kids playhockey dot com or click the link

accompanying this this episode in the description. Remember, we can't text you back

on that one. So if you want us to know who you are, leave your name where you're

writing from and any contact information. But as we always say, your opinion matters

on this. And if you're having FOMO or you're feeling something, send it to us,

right? We won't just put it on the air without asking you. Or keep grabbing me in

the hallway and having a discussion. I love that. I love it. Somebody grabs me and

says, you are full of crap. And I do owe a couple people, you know, some, some

YouTube commenting and some Facebook stuff and like, I love it. I mean, I, I'm all

up for somebody debunking a lot of these theories because I learn and we learn.

And I'd love to hear what's going on outside of my little bubble. And sometimes,

you know, I'm like, oh, I didn't really thought about that or I didn't realize

somebody was doing that somewhere. So, yeah, please, if we're wrong and I'm wrong

and I'm often wrong, just call me out. Let's hear it. And tell me what the

solution is. Yeah, I'll say it. We can be wrong. Our opinions can be wrong.

Yeah, gang, listen, Mike's making a great point. If we don't have the conversation,

nothing's going to grow. We've got to have the conversations. That's why really why

we started this podcast 40 ,000 years ago. All right, for Mike Bonelli, I'm Leahy's.

Thanks for listening to this edition of our kids play a hockey. Have fun, skate

hard. We'll see you soon. Enjoy your evaluation season. Take care, everybody.

We hope you enjoyed this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. Make sure to like and

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