Our Girls Play Hockey: The Hockey IQ Habits Every Young Player Can Build

SPEAKER_01 1:15

This episode is powered by NHL Sensorina. Hello, hockey friends and families around the world, and welcome back to another edition of Our Girls Play Hockey. It's my favorite intro to do. We're here with Haley Skimora of Team USA Gold Medalist, PWHL Walter Cup Champion. Haley, you keep expanding upon these things I have to say after your name in the beginning. Luckily, you've been on the show for over a year, so people know who you are.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:47

As always, lovely to share the stage with you today.

SPEAKER_00 1:49

Yes, you too. I'm excited to be here.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

I'm excited to have you. And it's an exciting topic today, gang. So listen, we talk about hockey IQ a lot, and we talk about it in a lot of different ways. Uh, this is an episode we've been wanting to do with Haley for a while because look, hockey IQ, it it's well known as something that's starting to lack in the game today, especially at the youth level. So the way we're gonna approach this today is skills versus hockey IQ. Okay. And I did use the word versus on purpose because you need both, right? And the idea is when are we gonna spend time on one versus the other? Obviously, they need to coexist, but you may be put in a situation one day where it's like, hey, look, I can work on uh this aspect of my skills today, or I can work on this aspect of my hockey IQ today. I mean, hopefully you can do them both at once. But these are things that's gonna happen. So listen, let's start with the obvious one, Haley. And we kind of anytime we do hockey IQ, I like to get someone's point of view on this, but we hear coaches talk about it. What is hockey IQ, right? Like, how would you explain it to a young player?

SPEAKER_00 2:50

Hockey IQ is, I feel like kind of understanding the nuances of the game. It's understanding uh the timing that you need in order to get open for a play or in order to create chances and opportunities, uh, being able to kind of see a play play out before it plays out, uh, being able to anticipate. Um, so it's a lot of the mental side of the game and just reading the play really fast as quickly as you can. So before it happens, you're already anticipating it and you're already going uh to wherever you need to go, whether that's defensively or offensively.

SPEAKER_01 3:23

Right. We were we were, I think we were talking on a recent episode about yeah, just reaction versus anticipation, right? And you want anticipation more than reaction. And in youth hockey, typically you will see reaction, and that's part of the growth, right? Like, like if you don't know the game or you're learning the game, yes, you will react, but the further into the game you go, it's anticipate. Obviously, in your career, you're literally a pro-Olympic level person at this. Um, I know you I know you never get used to hearing that, but it's true, right? And we we see that in your play. And I think when it comes to hockey IQ at the youth level, you know, especially for the parents listening and the kids listening, you know, it's like Haley said it, your ability to read plays, right? Now, the only way you're gonna learn to read plays is by playing. So there's a the you have to look at hockey IQ. All sounds contradictory to the episode name, but you develop it like you would develop a skill. You don't just go on the ice and Michigan, you don't just go on the ice and have a 90 mile per hour shot, right? This takes time. All kids go through the I can't get the puck off the ice scenario, right? Well, what do you do? You practice, you get stronger. So reps in the game, I think is the starting point of you want to get hockey IQ, be aware of what it is, first off, and then recognize in the situations in the game, did I read that well enough? Now I think that question, we always talk about great questions, demand great answers. That's not a question that's asked enough from the coaches, the parents, and the kids themselves. Uh what I'm hearing more of nowadays is actually disappointment when a play doesn't go the right way, right? Like I didn't shoot it or they scored on us. But why? The whole game of hockey, I feel like I say this in the locker room constantly. The whole game is based on capitalizing on the mistakes of your opponent. The whole game. So mistakes are like part of the game. I I I've said I think I've said on the show before, we don't have a stat for error like baseball does.

SPEAKER_03 5:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:24

All right, because in baseball, if there's a guy on second and you hit a fly ball to the left field, 99% of you can tell me probably what you should do. I'm not saying that's true every single play in baseball, but we have the stat error because there's an error that was made and known. Right. Imagine if we had that in hockey, it would be 55 errors a game. Yeah. Right. So it's when these mistakes happen in the game, or if you're able to create a mistake with the team, it's kind of like the aptitude of understanding the mistake or how to how to use that mistake to your advantage. Uh, keeping in mind, too, in the chess match of hockey, there's gonna be infinite possibilities on every single second of the game, right? Yeah, so and again, at your level, they do that more more than anything. But I feel like just stay on this for one second. Like, like for a kid, right, listening, going, okay, well, I want better hockey IQ, right? It's just about, you know, maybe just being aware of it is the starting point.

SPEAKER_00 6:15

Absolutely. I think you know, you can also like just watch hockey more. I think the more you watch hockey, the more you can kind of like notice and recognize patterns. And for me, another big thing was playing other sports. So for me, that was soccer. There's a lot of similarities in terms of the space that opens up on plays, like your running patterns, uh, getting the ball or the puck into space for someone to run onto it rather than write directly on their stick. Um, there's a lot of things that I felt uh translated in that sense. And I think that helped me tremendously with my hockey IQ. I also had my dad always talking hockey with me, like uh, you know, showing me plays on the boards. Like um, I remember, I mean, just growing up, whenever we'd have a game or practice, we'd kind of dissect different plays and be like, okay, what could we have done better on this play? Like when this is happening, you know, in the D zone, like you you dump the puck in, like, what's where's that D trying to get to, or something like that? I think it's talking through a lot of it with people who are your coaches or your teammates, even. I think you can like discuss the game a little bit more with each other, and that'll kind of help you like naturally learn the game as well.

SPEAKER_01 7:22

I I'm gonna say again to the coaches listening. I think it the key is in the questions, right? The brilliance of the question you just asked, Haley, what could we have done differently here? Coaches, I'm gonna say this. I I'm sure many of you do say that. I'm sure many of you think you say that. But the thing is, you might be saying, no, don't do this, do that. All right. And and don't get me wrong, there are times to do that, but that actually should be the result of that question is ask the kids what they see first. Yep, because that's the skill building of hockey IQ. You gotta let them think, you gotta build the critical thinking skills. You said to watch the game too. Um, I think the the disclaimer on that is again when you were growing up, when I was growing up, watching the game was a little different. It wasn't a highlight reel, it was yeah, watching plays developed from the defensive zone all the way through in the neutral zone. And now it's like, did you see McDavid deep five guys in the O zone? Well, that play started in their D zone because his linemates know to let him charge up. So, kids, I'm not against highlights going wrong. No, he doesn't love to see an amazing play or an amazing save. Yeah, but you gotta see the full picture there. All right, and there are channels available that'll let you do that. We yeah, we had we had Pavel Barber on once, and he said that you know he has his main channel that gets all the views, but he said he has a secondary channel that no one watches where he actually breaks plays down, which is like really in depth. And I'm like, I would actually be interested in that. So yeah, kids, you have to have a yearning for this kind of information, and coaches, you can cultivate that by what Haley said. The great question. What are some other options that we had here? I think that's important. Yeah, here's one, Haley. And you know, is it this this sounds like it's gonna be an easy question? I need you to kind of put your coach hat on for a minute, right? Yeah, but if you had to choose between a player with elite skills or average hockey IQ, or average skills and elite hockey IQ, who are you taking and why?

SPEAKER_00 9:16

Honestly, I'm going elite hockey IQ all day. I think the skills piece is so much easier to develop and work on rather than the hockey IQ. I think obviously hockey IQ can be taught, like we just have to work on it more, but I think the skills piece is a lot easier to see immediate improvement on, and then you'll also see it applied in a game probably more effectively and efficiently when they have a higher hockey IQ, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:44

I always use the example of the kid or kids that put in five goals a game, but give up six.

SPEAKER_03 9:53

Right.

SPEAKER_01 9:54

It's like I I don't know how to say it nicely. I'm gonna try to, but it's like you're not helping the team, right? You look great, you look great, all right. And and and depending on what your goals are, maybe that's satisfying in some way. But I can tell you as a coach, uh, I'd rather take a player that I how about this? I would take a player on the third line that I know is defensively responsible and is going to not give up a goal over someone with a with a minus plus minus, right? You know, consistently, I should say. Like, like look when you're a top scorer in a in a high-level league, you're going to get scored on too. Like, that's just part of it. Plus minus is not the only stat in the world.

SPEAKER_02 10:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:31

All right. But um, I gotta say that, yeah. A team with people with high hockey hockey IQ will probably beat a talented team, yeah. Um as long as as long as the skill is somewhat close. Right. I do want to say that you can be an ultra-skilled player with hockey IQ. All right, that's what you should all be striving for. Yeah. All right, but we wanted to make the point here that when we're team developing, I think the high hockey IQ bar bar none is what coaches want and what coaches look for. Yeah. Um, and that that you can work on your skills too. Like this is not an excuse not to be working on skills, kids, but I just think that's a very important question. You know, Haley, in your own like career, you when you talked about your dad and how you taught uh or how he taught you, but was there a moment or a time or multiple times um where you felt that you know you have your skill sets, but you're realizing, okay, my my understanding of the game is actually pushing me forward here. It's not so much my skill. I mean, I I'll be I'll start you off here. Like, I actually felt like we saw that last season, yeah both PWHL and in the Olympics. Um, your game just seemed to evolve, right? Um, and when we talk about the joking, like the 10,000 hours to master something, I feel like with you, you had the mastery of a lot of different skill sets, including hockey IQ, where they could put you at center, they could put you on special teams, they could put you out in a big moment, and it just seemed to click for you. So that was that was it personified, at least as a spectator, right? Yeah. But I'm sure in college and youth, there were other times as well.

SPEAKER_00 11:59

Yeah, I think you know, I don't know if I ever actually gave myself the credit for it or even realized where my hockey IQ kind of stood in terms of like among my peers and things like that. It was just always something that was natural to me and something that um I really enjoyed about the game. Like I like understanding the different aspects to it and like little things I can work on to improve, like with my timing, like getting to the net. Like I remember that was one I had video a video meeting with my USA coach, and I was just like, it was with the pro league, and I'm like, look, I feel like I'm I'm doing really well, but I feel like I'm not in the spots to produce, like something is like not clicking, and I don't exactly know what that is.

SPEAKER_03 12:47

Right.

SPEAKER_00 12:48

And so I remember he reviewed the clips and stuff, and he kind of came to you and was just like, honestly, you're just getting into like the crease area or like around the net, you're getting there too fast. And so then you're covered by the time you get there. And so it's all about timing and getting there at the right time so that when the puck does come to you in that area, you're not covered because that's easier to cover. Um, so it was a really simple cue, but it was something that kind of like stuck with me for sure, and something that I was made to be more aware of that I might not have been aware of if it weren't for video or if it weren't for my hockey IQ in the sense of, hey, I know something's missing. I know a piece is missing, I just don't know what that piece is. And it's like asking questions and seeing what you can get from other people from a different perspective.

SPEAKER_01 13:33

Yeah, I love you're bringing it up because it taps into the coaching side of this. And you know, I learned I want to say early on in my coaching career, I think that'd be fair uh not to assume players know anything.

SPEAKER_02 13:45

Um, right.

SPEAKER_01 13:46

And I I I remember being guilty of that, thinking like, well, they they have to know this thing that's very obvious. And it's like that's not always true, right? Like I've said things to players on my own national team about aspects of their game, and I'm always surprised when especially these are high-level athletes, and they'll say, Yeah, no one's ever told me that before. It's just like it's so so obvious to me that you do this, but I'm saying that to coaches because don't assume anything with whatever age group you're you're at, yeah. Like they may not have heard that before. So coaching plays a tremendous, tremendous role in helping people awaken to this. Now, keeping on you for a minute, because again, I I would say that uh your mastery of timing to the net um is is amazing. I mean, I really I I'm not just saying this because you always I think you're one of the best at it. I think that when I I send people to you as an example, I show them your video, right? Um, but let's go rewind back a little bit. And I'm gonna give you a big range here. You can go 10 to 20 years old. Okay. Um, what did you think at those times were like this is my best skill when you were in? And again, that's a wide range. Again, you can pick whichever one you want.

SPEAKER_00 14:53

Okay. When I would say when I was like 10 to like 12 or so, this was when I was on the boys' team. And my dad was the coach. And I was third, fourth liner. Like my goal was to was to PK. I loved the PK and to forcheck hard and create opportunities for the first and second line, right? Giving them that energy, giving them that boost. And I mean, my dad was always up front of it. It's it's my dad. Like he was always up front about that and kind of told me what you know my role was and things like that. And honestly, I kind of liked the PK rather than the power play. Like if I had to choose at that age, I was picking the penalty kill. Like I enjoyed it. I loved the challenge of it. I loved um, you know, ruining the other team's day, not letting them get any chances and things like that. So I would say I knew that was like my skill set. Like I knew I enjoyed doing that. I enjoyed battling hard. I think that's why I'm so good at like battling and puck protection and things like that, because I had to in that role.

SPEAKER_02 15:51

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

Um, and that was something that my dad was very uh honed in on for sure, was making sure I wasn't losing the puck and creating turnovers and stuff.

SPEAKER_01 16:00

No, no, but before you go to an older age here, yeah. I'm writing down what you're saying. Okay, coaches listening, parents listening. And Haley, forgive me for doing this. You're an elite, I gotta keep prefacing it. We're talking to Olympian here, okay? Notice the things she was focused on at 10. I wrote them down. The PK, for checking and battling. Yeah, how many, how many kids would say that today, right? Like this is a differentiator. I I it's important, and and then and then you also said like understanding your role at that age, right? Like, which Bobby Anzi, that's hard to coach at 10 and 12, right? Yeah, everybody wants the role of leading goal scorer, right? All right, so so I love that those are your answers, and and coaches, parents too, right? How much onus are we putting on those aspects of the game? Do you tell your penalty killers how valuable they are? Here's another question Are you putting your top two forwards out on the PK? Right, or are you are you giving that role to, as Haley said, a third liner to get this? Rest the top two lines. Yeah, that's the tactic we use. Um, I gotta ask this too, Haley, on the PK. I'm guessing were you usually near the top, like on the points?

SPEAKER_00 17:13

I think so.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

Did you enjoy uh uh stopping the D to D pass and going on breakaways too? Because that's what I ended up doing when I was probably yeah. All right, we can keep going just to the little older if you felt like you can jump to college or whatever you want.

SPEAKER_00 17:25

Well, you know, then when I did play girls' hockey, my role changed. I was usually like top line or two. Um, and so that was an adjustment for sure. And I also had to adjust to the physicality piece of it because I was getting a lot of penalties for body checking for one other.

SPEAKER_01 17:41

Um not anymore.

SPEAKER_00 17:43

Not anymore. Exactly. Exactly. Um, but I I had a different role in that sense. So it was more skill-based, it was more goal scoring, it was more um more power play time, uh, things like that. So it it changed as I got older and specialized more in girls hockey, obviously.

SPEAKER_03 18:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:00

Um, and then in college, I would say I was typically, I was also top two lines as well, I would say most of the time, especially like my freshman year. We didn't have many players. Like we were quite low on players. So I was kind of utilized right away. Um, and then as the years progressed, that's when I got the chance to play with like Kendall Coin on the top line, which was new, and then as a center as well, which was my first time ever playing center, um was in college. So I think yeah, I just got used to playing different positions and I was able to kind of figure out that position pretty quickly, considering I had never played it before. And it also felt more natural to me because I was normally a more defensive-minded forward to begin with. Um, and so I think that centerpiece came natural to me at that point.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

Well, it came naturally because of your hockey IQ. Like just I mean, and again, this goes back to what we're talking is you had built up enough of the hockey IQ that it naturally falls in place. You know, I I'll tell everybody out there listening. And again, we parents, you can tell your kids if the kids are listening great. You know, I remember when I hit the point playing, and well, again, I will call it the 10,000 hour point. I don't know if that's actually what it was, but I had built up enough skill sets where I could learn something very quickly. All right, and it's it's pretty amazing when someone says, Can you do this? There's a real short, obviously, period where you got to kind of feel it out, but you can feel the all the skill sets that you've learned in the hockey IQ combined, and then you can just kind of do it. Um, but that's developed in the youth hockey stages, right? And Haley said it through other sports, through playing different roles. I gotta ask this too, Haley. In terms of in terms of your league and in the world uh stage, like you're a taller athlete, right? In in professional women's hockey. When did that height come in? And did and did that change your game?

SPEAKER_00 19:49

I feel like I was always tall. Like I don't really remember my girl sport that much, especially in girls' hockey. I was one of the bigger players on the ice always. Um, and I think by also playing boys' hockey prior to that, I already had that physicality piece where I felt really strong and was able to kind of win my battles and play big. And yeah, um, but you know, I think when I got a lot of penalties, I think sometimes I had to make myself a little smaller. And so I would say the increase in them allowing us to be more physical, and obviously with now checking legal in the PWHL, it's helped me kind of play big again. Is it legal?

SPEAKER_03 20:25

Did they say that yet? Yeah, do we know that rule yet?

SPEAKER_00 20:28

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. It's uh a little nuanced, but yeah, overall more hitting for sure. Yeah, um, and yeah, it's definitely allowed me to play my game, but I was always one of the bigger players on the ice.

SPEAKER_01 20:38

Yeah, and and you know, size is an interesting thing because you'll have some players that will will grow five inches in one year. You'll have some players that that are kind of tall early and then normal out. Um, like especially when you're growing youth hockey, right? Your your body is changing so fast that you almost have to adapt to the game with that. But if you have hockey IQ, like again, if you're tall, if you're short, anywhere in between, there's actually advantages to all of that, right? Yeah, I can tell you right now, when I played again different era of hockey, um, where again, I just to set the table for the audience, you know, concussions were a day-to-day injury back then. So hits came a little more early and often and a little more egregious. Yeah, but it was never the tall guys that I was afraid of getting hit by, it was actually the smaller guys. Because if a if uh like I'm 5'11, if a if a five foot five kid hits me in a hip check, he's he's hitting me in the thigh. Like it's not it's not a it's not a good hip check. It's like I go flying, right? Yeah, but the the the some of the toughest players I ever played against were those players, and they knew how to use their size to their advantage. Adversely, it's not shocking, you're the one in front of the net. Yeah, if you're on the taller side, right? To screen the goalie, to get body position, to get strength. Um, doesn't mean that a smaller player can't be in front of the net either. I'm just saying these are things to think about as you grow. And and I think the key and the point I'm trying to make is you don't want to get locked in to one style of play. One of the one of the things that can stunt your hockey IQ quickly is I'm I am a center, right? I am I am only this, I am just in front of the net. It's good to know what you're good at. Don't get me wrong. Okay, like it's good to know, okay, that kid's really good at skating, that kid's really good at shooting. Like, you should know that. You should continually develop your other skills. And how this works with skill versus hockey IQ is you have to understand the game, the systems, the flow to utilize those different aspects of your game throughout throughout the play, right? So, again, for example, like the perfect line to me has a player that creates time and space, that has a playmaker and has a goal scorer. Yeah, if I get that on a line, you better watch out. All right, and and I will just throw puck moving defenseman and a stay-at-home defenseman as well. That's the perfect line. It almost sounds like we're playing video games and you're getting to select the line. Yes, right. But just in my head, family's listening, and Haley, I'd love your comment on this too, because like again, you're seeing elite lines put together. Every one of those players I just described has different skill sets, has similar hockey IQ, and knows how to play with the Person out there with them to create something. Right. I want to talk about that again. And we'll go to the Olympic level with this, Haley. Like, like when you're on a line, talk to me about okay, because you moved you moved around a lot as a 13 player. Yeah. Looked left, looked right, and said, Okay, I I know how she plays. I know how okay. Yeah. How do you how did you compartmentalize that before a shift started? Because and and I have a hard time you tell me, like, I can't imagine you just went out there and like, well, whoever I'm with, I'm with, and you know, I'm gonna play. But maybe that is the way it was. I don't know. You can be honest.

SPEAKER_00 23:46

Yeah, honestly, a little bit. I think, well, for me, I was being put on that line for a reason. And that reason is for how I play my game. And in that sense, it's the same regardless of whatever line I'm on. And that is to play aggressively on the four check and create turnovers, get ticks on pucks, is what we would say.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:06

And that would allow us to create chances offensively. So I never really changed my game in that.

SPEAKER_01 24:11

Maybe the linemates did then, right?

SPEAKER_00 24:12

But yeah, maybe they're like, oh, you know, Scant's got this, she's got it in the corner. I know how to go support her. Um, but yeah, I mean, I got to play with virtually everyone. And um, but it helps because yeah, I knew where they would be, you know, and I I knew how they would communicate with me and I would be able to like get them the puck or chip pucks out or certain things like that. Um, but yeah, I I kept my game the same regardless of who I was with. And um, but I feel like that style of my game like leads to that. Like it's easy to play with anyone with that style of play. Do you like does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 24:50

You're the type O blood of hockey. Yeah, you get along with everybody. That's that's what I'm hearing right now. Yeah, all right, is that your blood type works with everybody's blood type. Look, yeah, I'm gonna say it again. This is why you're so valuable. This is why you're on the team. It's it's like again, they kind of call you a utility player, but I I don't that's not a negative thing. Like, it means you can be used in any situation. And I'm gonna say this again, you know, when I talk about timing as it pertains to hockey IQ. Um, when we watch you, and again, by the way, if you're listening to the show and you don't watch Haley play, I mean you should go watch her play because um you're right about your timing. Like the um I uh there's gotta be a stat. I don't know where we would find this, Haley, but there's gotta be a stat about like pucks going below the goal line and and you know how many times you come out with that puck, or or like disrupt the play.

SPEAKER_00 25:40

Yeah, there definitely there is a stat for that for sure. Like, how many turnovers are you creating?

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Um forced turnovers on forced turnovers. I mean, because you're you're kind of a master at that. Like, like how about this? I'll I'll use the word disrupt. Yeah, like you're really good at just disrupting plays now. Hockey IQ, and like this is gonna be a fun part of the discussion, okay? When that comes to hockey IQ, I think it's insanely undervalued disrupting a play. Yep. You disrupt the D coming out of the zone on the blue line, you disrupt in the neutral zone. We could do a whole episode about disrupting in the neutral zone. It it hurts, hurts the other team dramatically. And these are definitely the plays that don't make the highlight rail.

SPEAKER_02 26:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:24

All right. The the little step up or the or the little bit of a lead with a stick, the or the forcing the player coming through the neutral zone to go to the boards. I mean, and that's all timing, right? Yep, invaluable skill. And I'll say that 90% of the time, if you disrupt the other team, they're not getting a goal.

SPEAKER_03 26:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:41

Or in your case, if you're disrupting in the offensive zone, you might get a shot.

SPEAKER_03 26:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:44

Right. So let's talk about how timing and disruption are part of hockey IQ. And then we should probably start getting into like some actionable items for the people listening as well. But but talk about that because you I'm sure you guys go through that at practice about you know cutting the ice and f disrupting. Like, what does that look like at the elite level?

SPEAKER_00 27:02

Uh, in terms of the disrupting, we would we would do a lot of like, you know, in tight zone stuff where it's like five on five. And the main focus was making sure you're disrupting the play whenever you can. You've got to get a tick on the puck. You can't let the puck go by you without it hitting your stick, without you making contact with the player or making sure it's on a clean pass.

SPEAKER_03 27:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:22

Um, so that was a big focus. And with that, it was making sure you have one pressure in hard, and then the second and third layer are in tight close, especially when there's um a like a contest for the puck, like a battle for the puck. Like you can tell, and that's again with hockey IQ, with anticipating the play, like, hey, our four checkers in really tight on this D. We can get a lot closer so that we're able to recover the puck faster for them and not just sit back and wait thinking the puck's gonna get like rimmed or or pass to the center or something like that. So I think it was uh that was a big emphasis for us at you know, for pro and for the Olympic level for sure, was being as aggressive as possible based on what you were seeing with the play and how it was developing.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

Yeah, you know, I'll I'll mention this too. Let's get into like and we'll close the episode on this, but just like ways you can do this in youth hockey. Because what so let's give a little disclaimer on this, too. The stuff that Haley's doing at the PWHL Olympic level, not okay for U10 kids. That is the result of this training, but that doesn't mean you can't start implementing aspects of it. So a great example, Haley. You actually inspired this one with with my girls' team, you 10 team, was this uh methodology or mindset of go hunting?

SPEAKER_03 28:35

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01 28:36

So we we put that on the board, big go hunting. Girls loved it. I mean, they really loved it. But here's the thing that clicked for them, they understood what that meant. All right, what I find in and this is not just in you in girls' hockey, but in youth hockey, there's often this hesitation to go get the puck, and and that where that comes from is the kids are kind of waiting to see what happens, right? Now, when you look at other sports and other things, there are sports where that is the case, right? Like in baseball, you have to wait for the ball to be hit in the play, right? You can anticipate a little bit, but not like in hockey, right? All right. So when we told the players, hey, go hunting, and this is how you start with hockey IQ, they got it, they started going for it. Now, what I don't want is all five players going for the cost. So now that they have that understanding though, of go get it, I can start developing. I say, and I say like this, you know, when we say go hunting, let me show you how to angle a little bit. This is what angling is. Obviously, you gotta look at the skating and the skill sets and and everything involved in that. Every kid's at a different level with this, but when you angle and go hunting, now you can force the puck here. And then you said you, the second player who's also hunting for the puck. Yeah, now you can go get the puck. That's that's how you start these things, right? And and again, when you said about layers, totally makes sense, totally makes sense to me and the audience. A 10-year-old's not necessarily gonna get that right away. I'm not saying that you were saying that, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's like coaches, you gotta you gotta find something that works. And I feel like I say this like every 10 episodes, right? How many times are you gonna have to teach it? How many different ways? A thousand, four hundred, six. Yeah, I don't have the answer. I just know that you have to keep trying different things until you find what works for that team or that kid. Yep. Right? And and you gotta be creative and curious and very patient. Yeah, all right. Keeping in mind too, kids have bad days too. They show up, they don't want to, they don't want to do it today. That that's gonna happen, right? So I think that if we're just talking about like three habits that we want to build, like that's my first one, is is find a way to create the the momentum in a game, the the the brain thinking, go hunting. There's 50 different things like that we could think of, right? Like another popular one of Youth Hockey is get in front of the net, right? I think there's better ways to say that, you know, defend this area. This area is your responsibility. Yeah, right. If you get beat, as long as you're there, that's okay. Let's learn how to now defend this area, right? Or another one, not to do all three. I mean, I'd love for you to have some too. But you know, one of the ones I was talking about is we always tell kids uh go hard, go hard, go fast, go hard. I don't know if if I love that one because I again your mind should be doing that, but as you've talked about all episode, it's not about just beelining it to wherever the puck is or where you think, it's about timing. Yep. So instead of go hard, it's I something like go smart. Yep. Go smart, right? Think about where you're going, right? Yeah, that's how I think at the younger age is you start to introduce hockey IQ. Yep. And then as you get older, Haley, I think it it is about whiteboard time and and watching film. Um, I always encourage kids to keep a notebook. I just think when you write things down or type them, you can put it on your phone. I don't care. Just put the information down somewhere so you're you're keeping it. Do you do anything like that? Do you have like a notebook that you keep in a rest?

SPEAKER_00 31:54

I I did I did have a journal for a bit. I haven't journaled in a while, I would say. Yeah, I'll but I'll write things down on my phone or I'll like save drills like on Instagram and things like that and certain concepts.

SPEAKER_01 32:07

But yeah, no, well, again, you are the top of the top, literally. Um but yeah, guys, I think I think that's gonna be the episode here. Like I said, it's just a conversation about the importance of it and that for the kids listening, understanding skills are important, but hockey IQ is also important, all right. And it's not a it's not a 85, you know, 15 thing, all right. Uh in fact, it's probably more hockey IQ than skill.

SPEAKER_03 32:33

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 32:33

Maybe 60-40. I think that'd be a fair, right? Because you gotta have some skills or it's not gonna matter. True, true. Haley, any final thoughts just on the hockey IQ versus skill debate? I think hockey IQ won the fight.

SPEAKER_00 32:45

I personally I think so. And you know, I know some of the skills with the highlight rails look really fun, and uh there's different like fun little tricks to work on, but realistically, you're not really doing those in a game very often. Like the hockey IQ piece, you're doing that in a game the whole time. Right. And so I just feel like that's more important to think on, and that's you with and without the puck, too, right? Like the skills-based stuff, like a lot of it is with the puck, which to be honest, in a game, you don't have the puck as often as you think you do. Um, so that's why I just think the hockey IQ piece is just so important because it's defensively, offensively, with and without the puck. It's all of those factors even on the bench tied into that. On the bench, yes, you're you're telling your teammates, hey, you've got time. That's hugely helpful. Or, oh, someone's coming down the wall. Like the bench helps so much with that communication piece. Um, and that's why I think Kelly Panic's one of like such a great player. Like, she's the best communicator I've ever played with on the ice, like on the bench, on the ice, you hear her, and she's so smart that she like knows what to say and when to say it. So things like that are kind of invaluable, I think, and um to a player. So I think the more you can build your hockey IQ, the better.

SPEAKER_01 33:55

Sounds like we need another guest that you just mentioned.

SPEAKER_00 33:57

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 34:01

Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 34:02

Um, my my final note on this is that is is to the coaches and to the parents and how to approach your kid. We all have a kid that comes over the blue line one on three and tries to beat everybody, all right. And no matter how many times you tell them, they do it 10 times a game. I really suggest you sit that kid down and tell them what you're looking for, right? All right, and why that's not the best way to approach the sport. Don't just yell at it. The definition of insanity comes in here, right? Just trying the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result.

SPEAKER_02 34:33

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 34:34

Like, and I actually think it's okay at times to tell that kid if it happens a lot, you're hurting yourself and your team.

SPEAKER_03 34:40

Right?

SPEAKER_01 34:41

It's not the right play, right? And again, how many times might you have to say that? Could be five, could be five hundred, but that's coaching. That's coaching, that's hockey. Yeah, um, but I love everything we went over here today, Haley. Uh great discussion for those of you out there. Uh, again, if you have any thoughts on this or you want to share an opinion or a question, email us team at our kidsplayhockey.com, or you can uh text us using the link accompanying the episode in the description. Uh, I have promised all of you we're gonna do a QA with Haley that will come up. We want to make sure we have a good amount of time to get some questions in before we do that. But that's gonna do it for this edition of Our Girls Play Hockey for Haley's Kamora. I'm Lee Elias. We'll see you on the next one, everybody. Take care and have fun. We hope you enjoyed this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. Make sure to like and subscribe right now if you found value wherever you're listening, whether it's a podcast network, a social media network, or our website, our kidsplayhockey.com. Also, make sure to check out our children's book, When Hockey Stops, at When Hockey Stops.com. It's a book that helps children deal with adversity in the game and in life. We're very proud of it. But thanks so much for listening to this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey, and we'll see you on the next episode.