Passed Over Twice, Still Made the NHL: Kurtis Gabriel’s Lesson in Relentless Belief

SPEAKER_00 1:20

This episode is powered by NHL Sense Arena. Hello, hockey friends and families around the world, and welcome back to another edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. It's Lee Elias with Mike Vinelli today. Christy Cassiana Burns is on assignments. But today's show is going to be great nonetheless because every young hockey player dreams of making the NHL. How many times have you heard that? We talk on the show all the time of you should never tell a kid not to dream. But the truth is this if your kid's playing youth hockey, they're thinking about it. And very few get to see what that journey looks like. But today's guest didn't take the easy path but accomplished that. He wasn't a first-round pick, he wasn't handed opportunities. In fact, he was passed over in the NHL draft before eventually hearing his name called. And from that moment on, he earned everything that followed. That journey took him to the NHL, where he built a career through grit, resilience, and unwavering commitment to his teammates. Along the way, he became known not only for the way he competed on the ice, but also for the way he cared for people away from it, earning recognition for his leadership and service in the communities where he played. Today he's become a powerful voice for the hockey community, helping players, parents, and coaches understand that while hockey can shape who you become, it should never define your worth. That is something we wholeheartedly agree with here. Because the greatest lessons in this game teaches aren't always about scoring goals or winning championships or making the next team. They're about resilience, character, perspective, and becoming the kind of teammate and person that others want to follow. Ladies and gentlemen, please join me in welcoming Curtis Gabriel to the show today. Curtis, welcome to Our Kids Play Hot.

SPEAKER_02 3:02

Brother, thank you so much for the beautiful intro. I really appreciate it. Uh, I could not agree more with everything you just said.

SPEAKER_00 3:10

Thanks, buddy. I'll tell you this that uh we were really excited when we were able to get you to come on because you really do just exude a lot of the things that we talk about. And while Mike, Christie, and I do a great job, I think, of having these conversations. The truth is this you were there, you did the work, you put the time in, and you have this mindset that we want to share, right? So let's go back to what I said in the intro about every kid wanting to play in the NHL, right? Uh you said you were one of those guys that did not exactly have the easiest time. You were passed over in the NHL draft twice before hearing your name called. Going back to you at that age, what kept you believing in yourself? And what would you say to any young player that feels overlooked wherever they play today?

SPEAKER_02 3:56

So back specifically to that time getting passed over in the draft. Uh, I'm gonna be completely honest, I had no opinion on the matter, um, which is funny to think because the way I came up was so crazy. I think we need to hear a little bit of the backstory to understand why I was thinking that way. Um, you know, I think growing up, I went to one Leafs game and I was more excited about the Cinnabon restaurant at the subway station down below because I got to eat like my mom let me just splurge and have a bunch of them. But I went to that game, I wasn't gonna play there. I'm like, wow, this is pretty cool. And I remember having a moment looking at the visitor's bench. We were across from the New Jersey Devils bench, and I was just like, for a split second, what would it be like to be on that bench? And then it was back to just being a kid and enjoying being there. Um, but if you flash forward to 16 when I'm a double A player about to hang up my skates because there's nowhere else to go. I gotta figure out what's going on with my life. My mom just pokes her head in and says, Hey, why don't you go try out for the junior A team in town, the New Market Hurricanes? And I'm like, why? She's like, Why not? You just finished your season. I know you're about to be done hockey, and it's 50 bucks, go have fun with your friends. And I'm like, okay, mom. And after I went to that tryout, I knew I was gonna play in the NHL. I mean, it was just it's what you were speaking about before we got on here that power of delusional optimism and that uh a woman's athlete you've had that's been the first most decorated person to win, I think, the gold medal in the professional championship or something. That's what it was. I just decided I was gonna be playing there. I didn't know how. I released the need to know how I was gonna get there. So when I got invited to a free agent training camp with the Phoenix Coyotes only a year after being in the OHL and barely playing, and I was running around my house getting that phone call, it didn't matter that the next year I had a terrible year. It didn't matter that I didn't even know I was still eligible for the draft. I just fell in love with the process. And I had just heard many, many times, if I'm good enough, I'll be found, and I wasn't gonna stop. So it was just inevitable.

SPEAKER_01 6:00

Yeah. So I mean, so I guess we're using the term you were overlooked, but not even you don't even think you were overlooked, right? Because you don't even think you were being looked at. So I'm just wondering, like, how do we tell players today? Like, it sounds like can you just go through that process then? Like you're you weren't a player that said, Well, I'm a prospect. How come they're not finding me? How come they're not seeking me out? I'm you're it sounded like to me, you're just you're just playing, and and somebody else saw something in you, but there had to be other things, right? It couldn't just be about your your inadequate play, right? I mean, what was it that that coaches and teammates and and and and uh you know recruiters and scouts, what did they see then to then say, wow, we're gonna take a chance on this kid?

SPEAKER_02 6:47

Right, yeah. So you know, playing double A minor midget, no scouts really watched that, especially where I was playing New Market. So I like going to the OHL was like going to Mars. Like I it was just I had no hockey dad, I had no anybody in my life with hockey insight. It was just completely unknown. Um, so that's why I was about to stop playing. What's the point of playing major midget? Um, but what changed was when I decided this is what I was gonna do, I didn't do anything else with my life. I didn't go to parties, I didn't play video games, I didn't just go take a day off. I just looked up on the internet with my mom. She said, All right, if we're gonna do this, we gotta make a plan. What do people do? Well, they they work out in the gym and lift weights, get bigger, faster, stronger. They get a private skills coach and work on their game and skating, and they eat, sleep, and breathe hockey. And that's what I did. And when I started doing that, I got noticed that those junior A troutes, and they went, Who the hell are you? This double A player. We can't take you from 16 as a double A player to onto our junior A team. You have to go play major midget. I did. A coach there looked at me and said, Kid, I see how bad you want it, but you're not gonna make it scoring goals or skating circles around people. You're gonna have to hit people. And I know the way you're gonna hit people, you're gonna have to fight people. And I said, Okay, where do I sign the contract for that? Because I've already decided I'm gonna play there. I don't care how I'm gonna get there. I've released that, I'm just going for it. And I started to play that way. So when I started showing up the next year to the next junior A camp, when I put in that year major midget, I was signed right away because I was just out there playing that role, hitting everybody. Um, and then I did not take skates off. I mean, I they the junior A team who I was now signed with said, hey kid, we know you like free ice and you just want to work on your game. Go skate at our junior C triouts, our affiliate team. You're not there to make the team, you're on our team, but just go play at their tryouts and get better. And I'm like, okay. And I didn't go out there and dog it like I was a junior A guy and I'm the cool guy. I went out there and I ran everybody over and I scored three goals and I got a fight. And what happens is there's an OHL scout named Brian Denny sitting in the stands, not scouting there, just watching. And he just went, Who the hell is that? Stepped off the ice after the fight and he said, Hey, do you want to try out the own sound attack? And I went, uh, what? I haven't even played junior A yet. Next thing you know, I'm at Owen Sound Attack training camp. So they they saw this unwavering belief that I didn't care whose feelings I have to hurt, who I have to step on to get there, and that was the nature of my role.

SPEAKER_00 9:05

You know, I love where we're going here, Curtis. And and we we asked that first question intentionally with the the hope that you would answer it exactly how you did, because so many people listening have that line of questioning of, oh, what was his resilience story? What was the thing that he pushed through mentally? And I love that you're talking about how that was not the obstacle, the belief was there from the start, all right. And I think that we we've talked about this on the show. One of the clear differentiators of we'll just say highly successful people, all right, if we want to define it that way, is belief. Not hope, belief. That is something I want to get into today. When I coach players, I actually tell my high-level players, hope is death for athletes. If you're hoping, we're not in a good place. I don't, I don't want your hope. I want your belief because belief is a lot stronger than hope. Hope means that we're not where we want to be. Now, with that line of questioning, I want to talk about identity a little bit. Because you talked about how hockey became your life. But I think there's a big difference between identity and intention. And I think that a lot of kids get tripped up with this, that they feel like I am only a hockey player, I have to be a hockey player. That's the way the mindset works. I don't think that's what you were doing. So, can you define for a minute here, using the word identity, how when you were on this path of belief and intention, it it was who you were, but that's not necessarily probably how you saw yourself.

SPEAKER_02 10:41

Unfortunately, you're wrong, brother. Okay. I did, I did become completely engulfed by the identity, and that's why I'm writing the book. That's why I'm sitting here retired, uh, four years into retirement. Um, I I got completely sucked in. And if you would have asked me at 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, all the way up, I wouldn't have said, Oh, I'm not a hockey player, I'm I'm more than a hockey player. I I'm smart, I got things to do off the ice. I I I'm gonna figure it out. I could talk all the game I wanted, but inside I'd already burned the boats. So I'm not recommending this. I'm not. Um, when I said that when I was 16 and I looked up online, how was I gonna make the NHL? And they said, you know, lift weights, get bigger, stronger, faster, get a skills coach, and eat, sleep, and breathe hockey. I missed the most important part that I know now that I would tell myself. And had I had someone like myself in my life that had been through what I've been through, I would have told my younger self, kid, just wake up every morning, sit on the edge of your bed and watch your breath and meditate. And my my younger self would have been like, why? That seems weird. Why? I just say, kid, don't analyze it, don't worry about it, just do it. And when you get to the NHL, you'll actually be able to enjoy it and stay there. And your whole identity won't be in it. And I've been like, okay, that sounds smart. And I would have done it verbatim. I would have just turned my, I just did things. I was just, but I didn't have that insight, and I wasn't supposed to have that insight. So my ego did get wrapped up in being only a hockey player, even though on the outside I'm this great guy, I'm doing social stuff, I'm helping in the community. I was feeding off that external validation because at 10 years old I lost my dad, right? And I had made triple A at 10 years old. I had thought that this is what I'm going to do with my life. My dad believed in me to get there. I went from single A to AAA. I've made him proud. He's crying. I made it, I made it, and two weeks later he's gone. So I that external validation was outsourced in an early age, that I got my worth from the game. That's what happened to me. And it it it shows that you can use that and burn that candle at both ends all the way up, but it runs out. You can't run on pain.

SPEAKER_01 12:48

You know, I as you're saying that, I I'm I mean, and I'm hearing you that that, and I think, you know, and a lot of a lot of the people we interview, you know, will say the same thing. Like that identity, although in the normal human life, right, like you want balance, but when you get to this, what the I I mean, one of the drivers to where you got was no balance. And I think that, you know, and I think you know, people, I I know it's easy for you to say, right? So here it's easy for you to say after the fact. I mean, you made the NHL. I mean, you played in NHL hockey, you are the one percenter, right, of the world of hockey. And so I think, you know, knowing like what what balance would you give? You know, not even with that 10-year-old kid sitting at the end of the bed, can parents help their children guide them into feeling like, yeah, I'm a hockey player, I'm all in. Like there's pieces of what I need to do and sacrifice. You said, you know, I didn't go to dances, I didn't play to video games, I didn't have really a social life. But all the pro athletes we not all, a lot of the pro athletes we talked to say, well, that wasn't really a sacrifice. That's who I was, and that's the reason I got to where I was. So what where but where are the where are I guess the warning signs for a parent? Now I'm 16, I'm 17, and my player, you see it, right? You see the child. You're like, well, he's not getting called up by scouts, he's not getting asked to play on the better team, he's not getting asked to, you know, uh you know forego one league to jump to another. How can we then as parents help mitigate the damage later on? Where when the when the when the game ends and the player didn't get to that level, where's that gap? Where's that piece that we can help with?

SPEAKER_02 14:31

100%. I love this question. That's a beautiful question. And to me, with what I've studied on my healing journey and what's worked for me, and what I've really embodied is that we can't change anyone, we can only model the behavior ourselves. We want to see the world change around us, we want to see our children um thrive. We have to model that behavior. Um, sermons and words and lectures don't change people. Energy does, embodiment does, you know. A beautiful flower doesn't request or coax or convince the bees to come to it, it's just fragrant, and the bees find their way. Your children will fall in line with your actions, not your words. Words can be very easy to say, but when the actions don't line up, kids notice. Kids are very, very observant. They soak up things like a sponge. Your actions have to line up with your words. Actions come first. That is what it's about. It's it's not the father who is saying, hey, we can't all be about hockey. That's not our only thing. But he comes home from work and then he doesn't spend time with his kids and numbs out with Netflix and beers. You know, it's uh it's the mom saying, Hey, we gotta, we gotta do our part and we gotta make sure we help in the community, but then decides to go get her nails done instead of helping down at the whatever. Like it's it's it's embodying selfishness or unselfishness. It's embodying these qualities of, you know, we're more than a hockey player, we're human beings, we have other interests. Um, it's it's yeah, the the the mom who's chasing her side passion on on the in her free time, you know, it's it's embodiment that changes. So I think it starts with us. We can't just tell our kids things and think they're gonna do it.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

Yeah, I think I think we're gonna take a pause in the episode and we're gonna go backwards to the episode we just did about community and about you know being involved and how you know, like almost a coach's obligation to be that person to spearhead those things because they're not innately, you know, innately part of what we do. Like they're just not something uh for a lot of humans, like you drop them off, you pick them up, you did your job, go home. Like, and I think you know, having that stewardship and what you're talking about about that mentorship, I mean, if it's not a parent, then right, then maybe it needs to be a coach, maybe it needs to be an organization, maybe it needs to be a team culture. And I think, you know, let's go backwards to to Lee's introduction. Why was it then when we you when you were in the NHL and when you were playing at that level, what drew you to those community partnerships? Like what drew you to do those things in like what made you so uh such an outstanding athlete in your community because of the things you were doing within the community?

SPEAKER_02 17:13

It's uh it's an interesting question to answer because I'm being completely vulnerable here. Is I got a lot out of it from external validation. Ooh, look at the hockey player showing up the hospital with the black guy kissing babies. You know, ooh, look at me helping out at the mission, look at me reading books to kids. I I enjoyed it. There was great intention behind it, but I still was feeding off this. Like, I'm this special person, I'm this special guy. And that's what led to me when retiring completely struggling so hard, like going through years of depression, anxiety, almost not being around. So that's because my identity was so tied to it, my self-worth was so tied. If I was a good hockey player, I was a good human. If I was a good tough guy, I could show up for people in the community. If I that's just the honest truth.

SPEAKER_01 18:00

No, no, I I understand that, but I mean, obviously, they that validation was uh you know built on the fact that these people actually did love you being there and did love you showing up and did love the fact that you gave up your time. So I think we talk about it a lot. Like when you when I give, like if I give to the Lions Club or I give to the Boy Scouts or I give to my community events, it's a little selfish. Like I'm like, I'm gonna get involved, I'm gonna help out. But I like it. Like I I enjoy the feeling of being welcomed. Like I enjoy the feeling of somebody saying thank you. You know, I really appreciate what you did. So, yes, you could say like, like yet that was part of your identity. And maybe it maybe at the time it was fake, uh, or I don't know the word, you know, I don't want I don't want to give the right word, or I don't want to give the wrong word and put words in your mouth. But it was it was like part of like what you said, well, this is what I need to do in order to stay relevant as a pro hockey player. Um, but all the people that you affected obviously didn't feel that, or else you would have known that, you know, everybody around you would have known that.

SPEAKER_02 19:00

That's that's the paradox, is that we're not gonna sit around and wait till I get my identity set before I go out and help people. It's part of the process, regardless if it was coming from a side of myself that was insecure when I went around those people. Oh, it was like a relief. You know, I wasn't the lowest on the totem pole in the locker room anymore. I wasn't the guy that can't skate where half my teammates look at me like I they would straight up tell me, I would never do that job you're doing. They didn't respect it. Other guys did, other guys cherished it, respected it. Some coaches did, some coaches didn't. When I got around Tucker Harlan, shout out Tucker in Iowa when he was four years old. When I was playing, he'd mimic everything I did on the ice in warm-up and I got to go hang out with him. Oh my gosh, it was like a relief. And and what I've now seen in my own healing journey and other people's, everything changes. When we stop thinking about ourselves, we step outside and we give back to someone else. We do as we would want someone to do to us. Because you know what's so crazy is a lot of the time we can't say the kind things that we can say to someone else. We always give the best advice to that fan, to that teammate, to that brother, but we can't turn it around on ourselves.

SPEAKER_00 20:03

So I want to pull the thread a little bit on this. I I'm gonna ask you a series of questions here. So, based on what you've just said, do you feel that when you were younger, we'll say kind of teens and even in the NHL, that there was a part of you that was present during those hospital visits, during the training, and during the game?

SPEAKER_02 20:25

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00 20:26

So this is where I'm gonna slightly disagree with you a little bit in the sense of I understand what you're saying about the external validation, and that was part of who you were. But in my opinion, and this is why I asked that question about identity, the present version of you was in there, whether they were growing or trying to be drawn out. And I think that the decisions you made, and they're good decisions, a lot of them, to help kids, right? What whether whether there was external validation in that or not, or to train hard, all of that was part of the journey to bring you to where you are now. Now, when the for the audience listening, right, when when you brain, when your brain connects to what the present moment is, uh, I always I always equate that to like the beginning of the universe. It's like a big bang goes off in your head, and you cannot see the world the same after you realize present moment thinking. It's it's not possible, right? And audience, if you have any questions about that or you want to dive deeper into that, um, feel free to email us or or you know, we love sharing that, right? But I agree with what you're saying in the sense of there was a another version of you during those times that the identity was attached to, okay, I'm a hockey player, okay, I'm doing this because this is what NHL players do. But I don't want you to sell yourself short because I think the the the positive, the good, the present version of you was in there. Maybe we could say growing or or building, but all of that had to happen for you to get to where you're at, right? And and again, not to go super deep into it with the audience, but a lot of times the path to this kind of awareness is through suffering, right? It's and it's that's kind of well documented, all right. Uh, but you have to walk the line. So I just don't want you to sell yourself short because I I know for a fact that those visits you made help people and inspire people. And even though there might have been a version of yourself at that time that isn't who you are today, I don't I don't think we should sell yourself short with what you've done. And again, just going back to the question I asked before, just to kind of make the connection point, I think there's a lot of kids out there who think if I'm not a hockey player, I'm nothing. And they're missing the present piece. And I do think that was inside you at a young age, right? And again, you can feel free to disagree with that too. I just feel like it's all part of the journey to getting to you where you're at today.

SPEAKER_02 22:40

I couldn't agree more. I I lean into the vulnerability and the side of the honest truth, but of course, I followed my highest excitement. There was nothing more exciting to me than chasing the hockey dream, even though I was gonna get there one way or another, it was so much fun to go down it. And I just did the best with what I could at the time, and you absolutely nailed it. Every single moment was perfect, leading me up to why I'm sitting here right now talking about this. And believe me, I don't sell myself short. I cherish every moment, I don't regret a single moment. How could I possibly? But what I speak about is I was so in belief that I was. This body, I was this human being, curse Gabriel, and I gotta do this and I gotta do that. And like you said, a lot of kids out there. If I'm not an occupiller, I'm nothing. Right. That's how I felt. And that is a recipe for disaster. Like you said though, a beautiful disaster that I have to go through. So it's not, do we want kids to go through that? No. Are they gonna? Yeah. But how can we bring more awareness to these opportunities to talk about things, to be vulnerable, to say as a parent, to say as a former NHL, this is what I went through. I'm not saying and I'm not trying to save you from going through it. I'm sharing my experience, and maybe you'll find yourself somewhere in it.

SPEAKER_00 23:58

Right. And we always say there's 8.5 billion experiences going on on this planet at any given moment, and every one of them is different. Um, and the ability for us to share our experience, and I I love that you're using the word vulnerable because uh so many people fear that, and it's such a path to being there. For the audience listening, give you a great example. Uh, when you go to work, when you go to the rink, uh inevitably someone's gonna say, Hey, how you feeling? How you doing? Right. And 99.9% of the time, I'm doing great, and you're not. So I've got myself in the practice, I've had people come into my job. Hey, Lee, how you feeling? I'm not feeling great today, right? But I'm gonna push through it, we're gonna work through it together today, right? And that's I'm just being vulnerable and being honest. And you know what? Typically, what I say that, Curtis, things do start going in the right direction because I put it out there. We talked about energies before. So, just to bring this back to hockey, I want to make sure the audience understands like this is all part of the journey, and hockey, especially youth hockey, is one of the greatest teachers, and it's one of the greatest abilities to learn these life lessons. Curtis, we say it on the show all the time. The the ROI on youth hockey is life lessons, it's what you can experience. I don't even love using the word ROI because a lot of people use that and go, well, if my kid makes college and they get a scholarship, that will have made this worth it. Abandon that mindset immediately, whether your kid is the top player on the team or not. If your kid leaves this game having learned something about themselves and the world and how to interact and how to be part of a team, and there's so much more beyond that, you've won. And I again, if you want to look at it like that at all, right? So when we're talking about parents, Curtis, like I said, we we try and put that out. That we know this audience obviously agrees with that, or they wouldn't be listening every week. But we say it you can cultivate the love, you can cultivate the life lessons, you can't create it. Your kid has to learn to do that on their own, and that's the journey they should walk. And again, man, you did that, right? You you you had that belief, and I think I want to go back to that one more time of belief. I think it's an underestimated, misunderstood aspect of success or the path, if you want to say that. Of I love your belief in yourself, and I wish more kids had an uncommon belief in themselves.

SPEAKER_02 26:18

I totally agree, man. And it's actually funny is that you talk about hope, get rid of that. Belief. I think it even goes deeper because the root word of belief is wish. And I think it became a knowing. Like when I walked in that training, that training camp of 16, I just knew like this is what I'm doing. I don't care how I get there, how long it takes. That's what I told Craig Channel, the Minnesota Wild Scout, at a Tim Hortons two and a half hours in a conversation right next to my house. He's like, What do I take back to Chuck Fletcher in my gym? I said, I will not stop until I make it. It's just that's just it. And he's like, that's all I need to hear. So it was a knowing, and it's funny because it's so paradoxical. I knew I was gonna play there, but every step in the journey that things happened still blew my mind. Right. You know, at 19, Christmas break, I've broken through. I'm this we're on this dominant third line in the OHL with one of the top teams in the in the league. And me and my mom are having an apple juice before we had home for Christmas. And my GM Dale DeGray just sneakily comes up with me with a smirk on his face, and he goes, Your son's get draft, gonna get drafted, NHL. And me and my mom almost spit out our apple. Excuse me? I was like, I'm not eligible. He's like, Yeah, you are third year eligible. You're going between the third and fifth round. Have a good night. And he walked away. How do you think that drive home was for Christmas? How do you think the presents for that year? So I knew, but it still didn't mean that there were not debilitatingly hard times through injury, through told I wasn't gonna make the team the year before to crazy things, but man, it was I knew it, and I just watched unfold because I just turned my whole intention and my whole life towards it.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

Well, I'm gonna say this for the audience. Let's let's dive into this, man, because I'm all about this stuff. Here's something I know, right? I've been writing out since a young kid what I know I'm going to do. Uh, and like every every few years, I'll I'll kind of reset the list a little bit. I'm gonna tell the audience this everything I've ever put on that list, I've accomplished. And I put some lofty stuff on that list. Okay. Now, this is where I'm gonna go with the audience because I think sometimes people hear that and be like, oh, okay, yeah, no, maybe. Uh, I've never met a person, and if you guys have, let me know. I've never met a person that has done this practice, truly believed what they wrote, and not succeeded. All right. Now, I want to read, I want to say this again. I have not yet met someone who's come up to me and say, Yeah, Lee, I did that. I wrote every day my my goals and dreams, but none of them panned out. I have not had that happen. I have had people say, Well, I wanted this, you know, I wanted this dream, but it didn't pan out. And that's gonna bring me to the crux of what I'm trying to say here. This practice is what I was gonna say, it's it's extremely hard. It's also extremely easy, it's paradoxical, as Curtis said, okay. To truly say something, I am going to play in the NHL. I am an NHL. I said that wrong. I am an NHL player. The the belief of that statement, whether you're 16 years old or not, to truly believe that is very hard to do at the start. And I'm gonna challenge our audience. I'm gonna share, I'm gonna share with you a question that changed my life. If you could wave a magic wand and believe something, what would it be? And you gotta take away all your preconceived notions about what would stop you from doing that. You can't say, well, I want this thing, but it's not gonna happen. That's not what I'm saying. I want you to really think about this audience. If you could wave a magic wand and have something, what would it be? Because that's your starting point. And I challenge you to write down every day I am the thing that you want to be. I am a New York Times best-selling author, whatever it is, and do that every day. And here's the thing at first your brain's gonna be like, okay, all right, maybe, maybe watch what happens when you do that every day and believe it when you write it. It'll change your life. Power of manifestation. I'm gonna say it to you guys again. I have not met the person yet that said, I did that for five years and nothing happened. All right, talked about energies, you talk about putting things out there. Parents, this is something not only should you do, you should inspire your kids to do it too. Because I think the younger you do it, the more benefit. There's no question in that. Just putting that out there. But Curtis, I'll throw it back to you. It's scientific.

SPEAKER_02 30:49

It's not woo-woo anymore. It's not, oh, that's too good to be true. It's literally all been studied at the top universities in the world. It's called delusional optimism. There's a reticulating activation system in your brain. We've all had the experience. The typical example, oh, I really like that blue pickup truck. What do you start seeing every day? Blue pickup trucks. Right. Your brain is looking for connections. Your brain is the most powerful thing on this earth. It is programmable so easily. Your brain is encased in darkness. It can't tell the difference between a saber-toothed tiger back in caveman days being in front of you or you being at the rink and your coach is yelling at you. It can't tell the difference. You give it the meaning. So when you start to turn your intention, your awareness, the most powerful thing you own, to what you want, everything starts shifting around you. And there's this beautiful formula by this guy named Daryl Anka. It's called chase your highest excitement formula. It's what Lee's saying. You chase your highest excitement, no matter what it is, whatever that magic wand Lee was talking about, whatever comes across your mind, pick it. Doesn't matter if you think it's possible or not, pick it. Do it to the best of your ability. Run at it with everything you have, with no insistence on the outcome. That part's kind of crazy to say that, you know, you know you're going to make it somewhere, but you have to release the outcome with integrity and evaluate your beliefs and fears as they come up. That unlocks the universe. I'm a living testament of that. I was doing that before I even knew what it was, but now I'm doing it with awareness and love and attention and service. Before, to me, in my journey, fighting people wasn't with integrity. I didn't grow up wanting to be Taidomi. I didn't grow up wanting to be the guy who did stage fights. That came from ego. That broke me down to realize that I need to go through the ceiling journey. And now I know that all I want to do is share my story and my knowing with others. And that's my highest excitement. The more I run at it, things start popping up. This podcast, connecting with amazing people, all these things falling into place. Lee, what you're talking about is scientific. It is not some unbelievable magic trick.

SPEAKER_00 32:42

Right. Right. And I think breaking that stigma is what you're trying to share, Curtis, amongst other things too. And I'll look, I'll tell the audience listening here one of the things I've learned on this journey as well is that we can't, you know, not that this is what we're trying to do, we can't make anybody do this. We can only share and try and inspire. And it's your choice, the listener, the person on the other end of this podcast, it's your choice to do this. And the patience you learn in this practice is, you know, should you make that choice great? If not, continue on your journey, right? That's all you can do. So I'll say it though, just because you said scientifically proven, I remember when I was playing, I had one of the highest face-off percentages. I'm not, I'm not bragging about that. I get asked all the time, why do you think that was? And I said it. I just never went into a face-off believing that I would lose a face-off. I always went into a face-off with the belief of I'm winning the face-off. I've won the face-off, right? Um, and that was how I approach that. My my it's not a regret, but my wish was I had learned this earlier or I had believed this even more earlier. Because here's the thing the goals that I set for myself, I could have dreamed even bigger. And I'm realizing that now, right? It's part of the process. That that would be some of my advice to your kids is and I know parents, you want to protect your kids from being hurt, but you should allow your kids to dream. Because if you allow them to dream and believe in themselves, they will go so much further than if you don't allow them. It's so easy to say, no, no, you're just gonna get hurt if you try that. You're not helping your kid or protecting your kid by telling them not to try, you're shielding them, and that's the process that they will continue to follow of like, no, I shouldn't try because I just might get hurt, right? You got to let them walk that path. Again, we're going a lot of different directions here right now, which I appreciate. Uh, Mike, I'm gonna throw it to you too uh to see if you've got any questions here. I want to bring you back into the episode.

SPEAKER_01 34:33

I I'm just taking this all in. I love it. I mean, it's just like stealing all this information to uh you know to present to all our you know, all our teenage kids that we work with, right? Um I'm just wondering, Curtis, you know, because you know, obviously the base of parents that listen to this, and and Lee just talked about it, and and you're you've you've said it a number of times, like you had to find that journey, you know, you're the one that had to find that realization. You know, you're the one that said, oh wow, like I realized what I was doing and and now where I need to go. And and you did this like almost like self-exploration. I'm just wondering, you know, from a parent's perspective now, knowing, knowing now, we all know this, right? We we it's the the the the answers right there in front of us, but you know, parents, what what advice would you give to parents that want to help? They can't make a player do this, like Lee said, you can't make somebody do this. But what are some of the like the guidelines that you would give? Because in today's world, it's it's a little different. There are video games, there are uh a lot of you know overscheduling of kids. There is a lot of roadblocks with social media and them seeing what everyone else is doing around them. You know, I mean, I think the blue the days of the bliss of thinking, oh, I'm the only one experiencing this are gone, right? Everybody sees what everybody's developing and you know that you're behind. Because the fact is you're watching a player on Instagram do something that you can't do. What advice would you give parents to help players get into this mindset, find this path without them thinking, oh, I made them do it?

SPEAKER_02 36:10

Yeah, just number one thing do not make your kid do one thing. I'm just have your set rules for the house of treating others well, certain chores, whatever the simple things of just basic. But I just I know speaking of my first hand experience, my mom is just the she's in a hockey book, the best freaking hockey mom ever. She just let me figure it out. There were so many times she's trying to point things out to me. I was so stubborn, I was so close-minded, I just wanted to go. She didn't have to wind me up. I was like the, you know, I never was gonna get shot as a lamb, I'm always gonna get shot as a lion. I'm always more fired up, you always got to pull me back. That was mine. So she just got out of my way. But if it's the reverse and a child just doesn't have that pull and that that energy to go to play hockey, or don't force them. But if they have it, if they have it, be that safe rock of unconditional love that is the blanket, safety blanket every time they stumble, they fall. And you remind them of who they are, why you love them, why you care about them, how hard they work. You see this trend online right now, people are taking their kids and they turn the phone around and they have the kid hold it so the camera's facing the kid's face, and the parent just goes, you know what my favorite person in the world is? Jaden. And the kid's face lights up. That's to me what it's all about. All about. Because if you are projecting your own lack of awareness on your own path where you didn't make it to the high level and you missed on opportunities, like Lee said, he didn't dream big enough, even though he's a cheese jumping, dream big enough. If you're projecting on, oh, they have to dream big like me, they have to do all this, it's only gonna cause friction to me personally. So I say let your kids figure it out and be there, be there for them and maybe introduce this highest excitement thing. Ask them what, like what Lee said, what if you could just do anything? If nobody in the world existed, what would you want to do? Okay, how are we gonna do that? Can we go after that? Can we try this, try that? That's gonna inform your kid. And like you said, Lee, and what you guys said to hockey. I played four years in the OHL, eight years of pro hockey, and 13 years of high-level hockey. It was like, forget the minor hockey, it was like 50 years of life experience that I got to learn through.

SPEAKER_00 38:16

We we say it all the time. The kids will face more adversity in a weekend of hockey than they will in a month of life, just the way the game goes. And you know, Chris, you're bringing up a great thing for parents to ask your kids. A great question, parents, you can ask your kids is just, hey, what's your dream? What's a big dream that you have? And here's the thing: they might not even have an answer to that. That's okay, because you presenting the question is going to plant the seed of, oh, mom and dad think that it's okay for me to think this way. You do have to set up the if you want to accomplish something, you've got to put the work in and you've got to take the steps. I mean, that's part of it, right? Uh, and there's no guarantees, but it's okay to have that mindset. I think another thing too, Curtis, you brought up too, uh, that we don't talk about enough, is the safe place for the kids to go at the end of the day. Um, you know, I'm I'm recalling now a situation from last season. My son's a goaltender, and obviously I'm pretty involved in the game. And a parent came up to me and said, Aren't you gonna tell your kid this thing that they're doing wrong? Uh, and it wasn't it wasn't like uh uh an emotional thing, it was just something how he was playing in that. I said, No, he'll figure it out, right? And I said, if he comes to me, I'll tell him, but I'm not gonna just go up there and tell him, right? And they and they were like, Well, but you know this stuff. I'm like, just because I know it doesn't mean that I have to go tell him. And I said, I don't want him leaving this ice uh uh or the rink thinking that that's that's what my value is on him. I want him to understand, and my daughter too, that you are safe at home, you are safe with me in the car, and at the end of the day, that's where you're gonna go. Because here's the truth, parents. And it's it's such a paradox, too. Your kids are feeling so much pressure without you during the day. I just don't think they need more from you. All right. Now, I'm not talking about parenting in the sense of you've got to raise your kids, you got to treat them how to be adults. Like you have to do that job. Uh, we shouldn't really call it a job, but you know what I'm saying. I'm saying is I don't know if I need to add more pressure on my son, who's a goaltender, who's feeling it anyway in the net, that he has got to get that from me too. I will reiterate if he asks, which he does all the time, hey dad, did you see anything I can do better? To me, that is the greatest honor that he's asking me my opinion. Now, parents, I want you to think about how many times you talk to your kids and they roll their eyes and go, you know, oh, I don't want to talk with you about this. All right. That's just not the place I want to be in with my kids. All right. So, anyway, that's just my own personal experience. But I think at the end of the day, folks, your kids want to have a safe landing place at home. There are so many kids that do not have that. All right, so many kids. All right, and I think that that's not just important for their you know growth and their sanity. I think it's important because now you're teaching them how to be a parent when they get older, too. It's all part of that process. So, anyway, again, we're having a lot of conversations here without questions coming out of them. This is this is what it's all about. This is this is the juice, this is the good stuff, man.

SPEAKER_02 41:11

Yeah, no, I I agree with you on that, brother. No, that you what you said about your son there is so beautiful, man. If he asks, okay. I've done 19 episodes of my five plan podcast, I think uh 12 are out, or 50, no, 15 or out. Almost every guy has been a guy I either fought at the NHL or pro level or played against. There has not been one guy who had to be told to be on the ice first, right? There wasn't one guy who wasn't begging his parents to play more hockey.

SPEAKER_03 41:43

Right.

SPEAKER_02 41:44

Okay. I remember Sam Moran in particular. His family was starting a catering business, they're really busy. He saw his parents put work into something. He said, at five years old, he said, I'm playing the NHL. And he said, from that day, his dad was like, geez, like you really want to play in the NHL. Like he was dragging his bag to the ring to play. Okay. If you don't feel that way about hockey, that's okay. 100%. Just because your teammates feel that way, your buddies, your friends at school, that's okay that you don't feel that way. And that's okay that if you wave that magic wand and don't know what you want to do, that's okay too. How exciting. How exciting. Write down a list. Sit down with your parents and go, what do I like? If it's right now this video game, and that's your highest excitement. Okay, let's do that. But let's also get some exercise. Let's be holistic about it. Um, I like playing the flute. Run at it. I can sit here today and tell you that no matter what, if you just follow your excitement for things, it will take you the whole way. And for me, that I know, I know is that my excitement for the game of hockey, regardless of the trauma I was going through as a kid, my pure passion for the game led me to the point that I developed such willpower and discipline of like I was cooking my meals at 16 to gain weight, guys. Like I, my mom didn't have to do a thing, just show up and be there. But that prepared me for when my ego did get so sucked into being just a hockey player and it all collapsed in on me in retirement. I thought I was gonna play till 40, you're not 29. That discipline and willpower was what prepared me to do the work to go inward on myself, which is what I talk about with meditation. And just let's bring that down to kids' terms and parents' terms. Could you imagine kid out there or parent out there? You're coaching you make a terrible turnover at the blue line. You just made a silly play, you tried to make a little bit of a selfish play, you tried to put it through a guy's skates, it goes back the other way, ends up in the net. And you come back and the coach is yelling at you, your mind's going crazy. I know my I would never play another shift that game because that was my role, and I would have been thinking about it for two weeks and working on practice and torturing myself, trying to figure it out how to do it better next time. And then I get there next time, I'd be all tight. Imagine be able to see those thoughts come by like clouds in the sky. Imagine to see these emotions well up in you, like dark thunder clouds, but be able to know that oh, I'm witnessing them. I'm separate from those. I can, I'm okay, I'm safe. I can feel those, and they're gonna be here now, but they're gonna leave, and I'm gonna put in the work and I'll make a better play next time. Imagine having that separation from it because I didn't, and it was awful. Imagine having that ability. All the best players and any sport, Simone Biles, Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, Michael Phelps, meditation is talked about so much. Right. So go ahead, Mike, my bad.

SPEAKER_01 44:17

Uh, I'm just saying, you're we're we're on the subject of coaches, right? And it's and that's really the most, you know, in the in our sport, in any sport, right? That that's that that person uh could really uh be the most influential person, positive and negative, in a player's life, right? I mean, I think the just to your to your point, you can have a coach that you make a mistake and you'll never see the ice again. You have another coach that might say, okay, make a thousand mistakes. And and and I hope you do more and more because I think you're learning. But within both of those sides, whatever coach you are, there there has to be consistency in the messaging. And I think there has to be uh, you know, whether you're gonna drive that person or not in the direction. What can coaches say? What would you do, you know, based off of the people you had as coaches and mentors in the game of hockey that you would say helped you kind of it wasn't it's not even grounded, you know, find your way to be the what the player who the player you were gonna be and allowed you to say, well, I could, I could, I could just make this mistake, or I can, I can. Follow this this this side of the game that I that I need to follow because a coach is telling me, okay, Curtis, like this is your role, this is what you're supposed to be doing. You're not gonna get punished for going outside of this.

SPEAKER_02 45:33

That's interesting. At a young age, because I didn't play at like a high, high level, single A and double A, it was just having fun. So I didn't have many experiences with that there. It was just go go rip it. You know, I I think I had great coaches from that. I didn't feel ever like I was gonna be punished for just trying to play hockey for fun and make a play.

SPEAKER_01 45:50

Um, it's a whole different which we're hoping a lot of our young coaches feel like that that ultimately, like nobody's getting fired. Oh well, hopefully nobody's getting fired over a 12-U hockey game. So I think that I think that's a a great message just from our coaching perspective. That the fact that you didn't feel that, I would say that most of the coaches we talk to, they feel some pressure. I mean, some of the players we talked to felt pressure, yeah, but didn't feel like this overwhelming like if I do this, my my life's over.

SPEAKER_00 46:18

Well, let me dive in here too, Mike, because and and Mike, you and I have both coached at an incredibly high level. And here's the thing of my approach that's funny. And Curtis, just for your your understanding, I coach a women's national team right now and a 10U girls team right now. So you can look at that like they're the exact opposite end of the spectrum. Uh I coach them exactly the same. All right, and and what I mean by that is this is there is there more onus on winning at the national team level? Okay, now, yes and no, okay, in the sense of yes, you know, if if that team does not succeed, I will probably be out of that job at some point. Okay, like that's something that is true, but that that does not dictate how I approach coaching that team. Because my mindset for coaching that team is just like the kids, like parents, listen, am I helping these players become the best versions of themselves? Are we focused on being a team first and taking care of each other? My belief is that if you know there's a tactical side to it too, don't get me wrong. But my belief is if we take care of the people, the people will take care of the the team, and we will we will have the eventuality we're going to have. If I was going to coach of if I don't win this game, my job's gone. I'm not gonna coach well. I'm gonna coach horrible in that environment. I can't do it. All right, I know the stakes, I know the situation, but here's here's this cool statement, right? I'm not coaching to get fired, right? All right, and I'm not coaching to keep my job, I'm coaching to do the best possible job I can to share what I know and teach these players, and they teach me too. That's true at both levels. I learn as much from these 10-year-olds as I do from the national team players, and it is my belief that I'm sharing everything I can with them. But but the only difference in approach, honestly, I'm really thinking about this, is the national team players have a deeper understanding of skill and tactics than the 10-year-olds do, but it doesn't change how I approach the team, right? And and again, I still have a job, so I'm I'm clearly doing something, right? Not that that's how I identify here, but like I just wanted to make that point, right? Go ahead. Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 48:34

When and what's your highest excitement leave every day walking into that room as that coach?

SPEAKER_00 48:38

Oh, just being with the team and and teaching. Like, I just I listen and really their excitement feeding off of them and that energy too, right? I just love being at the rank with my I'll say my family, because that's how I view these teams.

SPEAKER_02 48:51

That's it, man. That that's why you're approaching it that way. You're not walking in there with ulterior motives, I gotta do this, or I gotta, I gotta win at this level if I'm gonna make it to pro hockey and coach men's hockey and this, you have none of that. You are present, you are chasing your highest excitement to build a team atmosphere. What do we say? It's process over outcome, but it's so funny when you take care of the process and you let go of the outcome, right? Watch the magic happen.

SPEAKER_00 49:16

Right. And I will say, and to be vulnerable too, that the younger version of me coaching did not think this way. I had to go through a process and have a nervous breakdown to get to this point, right? It's it's a similar story, right? You you no one can handle that level of pressure forever. All right, if they tell you they can, they're not telling you the truth. All right. But when I let go of those outcomes and found my enjoyment, not only did you know I enjoy it more, but I from a from a quote unquote success level, if that's how you want to define success, I I did do better in terms of where I got, but it wasn't even about that anymore, right? And like I said, I take just as much enjoyment out of these 10-year-olds playing coaching these 10-year-olds as the national team. And my kids, when you when you can see that it's it's a pretty prolific change. I I don't want to forget to say this too, because you brought it up, Curtis. One of the things we talked about, you talked about the clouds in the sky and the storms in the sky. One of the things we talk about with the kids is if you're able to identify the emotion you're feeling and call it out. I'm angry, I'm excited. It doesn't always have to be negative emotion, right? Because positive emotions can actually affect you too if you're not careful. Being able to kind of it, you know, separate your conscious from your body is basically what we're talking about. For those of you who want to do more research into this, but call out what you're feeling. As soon as you call it out and you have an awareness of it, you can start to control it or work through it, or whatever word you want to use there. But kids, parents, adults listening, this is for you too. You don't have to live in that emotion and suffer in that emotion. All right. Your ability to call it out is a power, it is a force. And as Curtis said, we are we are learning about this as a society and as a species right now more than ever before. I'll say it again. I have yet to meet the person that's discovered this, was like, it didn't work, it didn't work. You know, you you have to have some patience with it. It's not perfect, not a perfect process. All right, but you learn that patience of, you know, I'm really angry right now. Right? I and and and I'm feeling that, and that's okay, right? You move through it. Okay. Again, no question there. Um, I just love that you brought up again the excitement, Curtis, because I'll tell you what, whenever I am near a rank right now or get on ice or get off the ice, every time now uh I have a gratitude statement that I say in my head that it's just so beautiful I get to be on the ice today, right? No matter what's going on. Winning streak, losing streak, it doesn't matter to me, right? So find that group, find that parents, you know, when you're in that rank. Even if you're just a parent who's watching their kids, man, how wonderful is it to get to watch your kids on that ice having fun, right? And they are having fun, hopefully. All right, Mike, where do we want to go from here? I'm all over the place today.

SPEAKER_01 52:05

No, no, that's okay. I mean, I so you know, I'm just I'm just wondering, um, you know, because we're coming like again, we we could probably talk about a million different subjects, but we are limited in time. And I'm just, you know, just from my perspective, you know, you're like the legacy that you're leaving, you know, as a player, you know, you know, you you everybody has to retire, everybody has to get out of the game. You you you know, just said you probably got out earlier than you ever thought you would. Uh but now you're taking that and in a lot of ways, you know, now giving us all the tools uh to try to get other people there, right? And then how to deal with it when you get there, or how to understand the the trials and tribulations of you know when you're when you are finished with the game. Can you just talk a little bit about you know as you're going through this process right now and and going through this kind of reinvention of yourself from a from a player and a tough guy, right? To to a to now a speaker and uh a commentator and somebody that's writing and helping others, you know, what are certain things that you'd love people to remember in this time right now that that you that you're changing about yourself, you know, that we could kind of reflect on a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 53:27

Uh I just think the main thing is that, you know, we're all out here looking for this thing called happiness, whether it's melting into the moment as a player on the ice, and you just everything melts away and you get in that flow state, that zone. Whether you're a parent at your job or watching your kid, you get in that place. We're all looking for this peace and happiness, but we're looking for it outside, outside of ourselves. And it will never be found outside yourself. Everything outside yourself comes and goes and changes. The only constant is you, this awareness, this feeling that you exist right here, right now, in this present moment is the only thing that will not change. And that's the work. That's the work is to start looking inward for these feelings of gratitude, fulfillment, peace, happiness, because that's the only place there are. When we get something on the outside, like we melt into that moment in hockey, like I did, especially scoring that like second NHL gold jersey where I got to celebrate, and I just evaporated, I wasn't there, and then boom, I was back, and I chased that feeling. Well, that feeling wasn't outside myself, it wasn't the conditions of hockey that just revealed it to me then and or that gave it to me. It revealed it to me. Like it was already inside me, and that feeling got to be exposed because I was just letting go and just being present. We can all cultivate that, not playing in the NHL, and that's what I do now. I am more fulfilled and purposeful and happy than I ever was playing in the NHL, sitting in office talking about these things. And we all can find that excitement our own way, follow that, and slowly turn inward. And the meditation, I mean, it's just everything to me. I'm I'm every piece of advice, anybody, they're gonna say, How did my daughter make the PWHL? How does my kid get to college? How do I do this? How does that the answer is always the same thing is realizing that you are not these thoughts, you are not these emotions that hijack you, that get you off base, that make you go numb with things that you shouldn't be doing. Um, it keeps you present. So for me, that's where it's always gonna come back to is discovering what's in here, what you really are, what we all really are. Um, because to me, that is the purpose of life.

SPEAKER_01 55:27

You you mentioned you mentioned earlier that you're doing a show and you're doing these series, right? Of talking to a lot of the guys that you fought. How do they feel about that? Are they like, where the hell was that guy when he was pounding the crap out of me? You know, where was the reflection? Where was the, you know, where was the introspection? You know, I think I'm just you know, it's just a funny, it's so funny to hear you, because I think that's where like a lot of us like have to understand too, like your identity, and again, maybe I'm wrong, right? But your identity of what you were on the ice isn't the same as when you're now you're at the dinner, right? So I think the ability for athletes, like we we've talked about this with a number of different players that have played different roles in in the NHL. That you know, don't like when you see me at the restaurant, that's not me. Like, that's not who I am. I am I'm not that guy like like I mean, uh you know, you're seeing me against, you know, you know, playing the the maple leaves that I'm brawling, but that's not like that's not me when I'm at the restaurant.

SPEAKER_02 56:24

I was a teacher's son. My one's a good grade seven-eight teacher. I had perfect behavior in my report cards. I've never been in a fight off the ice, but I've been but I've been in 137 bare knockle fights because I was doing it for out of pain. Okay. I never I grew up watching Rob Brindemore block shots and play hard and then getting in a random scrum with somebody and falling on the ground in a in a tussle, not actually squaring up a center ice. I didn't grow up watching wanting to do that. I I was forced by my own conditioning and what I thought would make me happy to do that. I am never been that guy. Uh, and it's funny, Chris Thorburn, the guy who fought my first NHL game, I have him for my first episode of my podcast. And he by the end was like, Gabe's like, what the hell, man? I've never talked to you. All I remembered about you was before that game, Blake Wheeler and Scheifley and all these guys are like, Hey, Thorbs, like this Gabriel guy's drooling for it. Like, he's coming after you tonight. And he's like, crap. But he's like, You you come on that, I come on here, and you're like, I just met you now, and this is like, who are you? Like, this is amazing. I'm like, yeah, that's who I've always been, man. It was just buried behind all that stuff. And um, yeah, it's they all well, it's funny enough. I just had Brian McGrattan on. If people don't know Brian McGratt, one of the toughest players to ever play, one of the most best fighters to ever play, one of those feared guys. He was crying on Monday on my podcast, talking about how meditation yoga going inward has changed his life. And how the hell did he not know about this earlier and what kind of hockey player he could have been? And now he's just so happy to be able to wake up every day, feel the peace in himself, not needing to do anything. He's going to yoga. He's taking his kid, his son Gabe, Gabe, son Gabe, take going to yoga and teaching him how that can help his game. So there's some guys who are on their own journey with it. They're like, wow, this is amazing. And other guys are like, especially the tough guys, Riley Cote, Brian McGrattan, Cody Bats, Terry Ryan from Shorsey, they all know because they've gone through the suffering, as Lee said, and the suffering is what wakes you up and you find the truth.

SPEAKER_00 58:14

Yeah, I'll tell you all listening to this too, that you know, we we we always say you can't achieve, you know, present moment. It's not it's not an achievement, right? Uh it's a process. And you and when you get there, you want to stay there, and then you have to continue to practice that process. But if you're able to to find yourself getting to that point, no matter how old you are, it is a blessing. Because there are a sobering thought for the audience. There are people that are born, live their whole life, and die having never been present. That's a truth. And and when you have discovered the present moment, it's life-changing. And you know, I think all of our hope here is that this conversation inspires you in some way to either continue practicing it or you know, to have some curiosity about what is the hell we're talking about, right? And maybe, maybe find it on your journey. But as you said, whether you're bare knuckle fighting in the NHL or you're a kid at home, it it you're on your path, and we're all on our own paths, and hopefully that path can bring you to that space, right? And uh, and again, I think that's that's the we talked about the word wish before. That's our wish, is that you can find that. And the last thing I'll say before we close this out is that if you're going to mind your emotions, I'm sure there's some of you out there right now, and this is how I like to help people. You might have a judgment voice in your mind right now. It's going, yeah, well, if I played in the NHL and I had that money, I could do this too. Or yeah, if I was doing what Lee and Mike are doing, I could do that too. This is part of the process is to recognize that judge voice. That's not who you are either. All right. And if that if that's happening right now, again, it's not it's not on me to create this for you. I can only cultivate it for you. If that's happening for you right now, just be aware of it a little bit, see where that takes you. All right, because all we want at the end of the day is if to we want everyone to be present. It's like it's not it's like join us in presence. It's not, hey, you'll be better off if you're with us. That's not the message, gang. It's just we want you here too. Right? So, Curtis, I'd be remiss if I didn't say this before we ended. First off, uh, the name of your podcast again, because we want everybody to listen to that.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:34

The Fight Plan Podcast about the fights on the ice and in sports, but more importantly, the fights we all undertake in life.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:40

Podcast helping podcasts right now with that one. And then also want to let the audience know we're you're working on a memoir. I know we can't wait for that to come on and read it. We'd love to have you back on when that's released at some point in the future. Um, and then for the audience listening, uh, if you're not following Curtis Gabriel, obviously look him up at Curtis Gabriel underscore is his uh Instagram name. But uh follow him uh because this podcast is not the only time he talks about these things. Okay, this is a journey he has been on for a while. He's been sharing it for a while. Um, Curtis, you know, I enjoy the stuff that you put out, uh, and I think you all will too. So if this if this podcast inspired you or you or piqued your curiosity, that's another great place to go, right? So, and for the audience listening, we are gonna have Curtis on the ride to the rink. So if you're going, man, this is great. I want my kid to listen to this, but we don't have an hour to do that. Come on over to the ride to the rink when that's released with Curtis on the next episode. But Curtis, thanks so much for joining us on the main episode of Our Kids Play Hockey today. Thank you so much for having me, guys. My pleasure. All right, gang. Remember, if you have any thoughts or questions, uh email us team at our kidsplayhockey.com or use the link accompanying this episode in the description. Let us know what you think. It's a conversation. Uh, but with that said, for Mike Vinelli, for Curtis Gabriel, I'm Leah Elias. We will see you on the next edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. Take care, everybody. See you soon. We hope you enjoyed this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey. Make sure to like and subscribe right now if you found value wherever you're listening, whether it's a podcast network, a social media network, or our website, ourkidsplayhockey.com. Also, make sure to check out our children's book, When Hockey Stops, at When Hockey Stops.com. It's a book that helps children deal with adversity in the game and in life. We're very proud of it. But thanks so much for listening to this edition of Our Kids Play Hockey, and we'll see you on the next episode.